I did about an hour and a half interview with Niko Choski this weekend. Niko is a great guy and he treated me very well. His podcast is rooted in the MGTOW side of things and as I’ve said before I’m not really an adherent of that lifestyle obviously, but I do understand and appreciate the motivation behind it.
Just to reiterate it again I don’t subscribe to PUA, MRA, MGTOW or any other tenets in full. I have issues with all the various branches of the manophere and I think all of them have something to positively contribute to a better understanding of intersexual dynamics. It’s my take on the MGTOW side of things that the one common thread these guys share is putting themselves as their own mental point of origin,and I go into that a bit in this interview.
Not all MGTOWs are cut from the same cloth. As I understand it Niko puts himself out there to engage women, but his perspective is one of ROI and making himself the primary frame setter when he does. As I stated before, my main concern is men isolating themselves socially and I think that taken to its extreme MGOTW can lead men to a self imposed isolation. Niko and I discussed this a bit too, as well as covering the true forced loneliness groups.
That said I think there’s more Red Pill common ground in the mindset. Yeah, I get that any man’s wife is empowered by the state to essentially be the deciding factor in how that guy will live his life. I’m not advocating for marriage, and certainly not in the hostile social state it’s in today – but you don’t have to marry or even entertain monogamy to engage with women. Regardless of how you go about it, becoming Red Pill aware will necessitate that a man ‘goes his own way’ in some respect. Applying Red Pill knowledge may mean you learn Game or it may mean you simply decided to recuse yourself from it, but that awareness will require you to put yourself first.
So, have a listen and let me know what you think.
In other news the Man in Demand conference is down to the last 4 or 5 tickets by my last count. It will sell out soon, so if you’re still on the fence now’s the time to get your reservations set.
[…] By Rollo Tomassi […]
Thank you
Solid interview Rollo. One thing id like to add that i think would help clear up the blurred line between the basic distinction of alpha/beta: its subjective, and depends on the girl observing the guys behavior. Remember from psychology: the archetype that the father sets in childhood sets the stage for what she looks for in a man for the rest of her life. Therefore, an alpha is a man who displays the masculine traits of her father. We also know from psychology that girls are black or white about judging the man in question, since they decide if they… Read more »
Happened to catch it last night when it had just been put up. I would suggest that the company of men is not social isolation. I would also suggest that the extreme of MGTOW isolationism is mostly TFL guys using MGTOW as a rationalization, rather than an effect of MGTOW itself. I note that torture is within the sphere of human experience, but I wouldn’t recommend that anybody seek it out on that basis. I would also point out that English generally has a meter of eye-AM-bic pen-TAM-eter, but then I have defended NUKE-ya-ler as non-standard, but not incorrect because… Read more »
“I don’t subscribe to PUA, MRA, MGTOW or any other tenets in full. I have issues with all the various branches of the manophere and I think all of them have something to positively contribute to a better understanding of intersexual dynamics.”
The manosphere desperately needs more guys like Niko and yourself. ‘Divide and conquer’, like we’re seeing so much of these days from the various factions is a waste of time and energy.
Hey Rollo,
Could you please explain in a few lines, in a future post, what exactly you mean by one’s own mental point of origin.
Thanks😊
Hey Rollo,
Could you pleasa explain in a few lines what exactly you mean by one’s own mental point of origin.
Thanks
@anonim77
Read here for info on Mental Point of Origin:
http://therationalmale.com/2014/11/14/mental-point-of-origin/
@ Rollo I listened to the podcast (good stuff as usual). One idea that crossed my mind – and it’s more of the idea of getting the message out versus site clicks or any type of monetary gain. How about something similar to bumper stickers (or similar) with something as simple as “The Rational Male”…like a bread crumb trail for more men to find this valuable information. You can decide to include the URL (or not). I know it could have the possibility of the bad elements coming with it (i.e. trolls, etc…) but it is another avenue to explore… Read more »
@ rollo I get hypergamy , AF/BB, Good girls do, medium is the message etc. I understand that a woman will decide in minutes, sometimes seconds if she’s going to Fuck you. It’s just that sometimes I believe that a woman has you marked as alpha, she gets the tingles, she is dtf, but then an alarm goes off and because she is hot for you and would like more than a ONS she will pull back and snowflake about not being that kind of girl etc. I’m talking about 30 plus post Smv peak women here of course. I… Read more »
@Play Don’t Pay: I think you’ve summed it up pretty well yourself. The slut shield goes up when she’s angling for some degree of commitment. She’ll also likely do this in a push/pull cycle as well, to create an addictive response to her, the same way a slot machine feeds out small “wins” to keep you playing, even though your wins never come up to the level of your loses. So there’s the message. You simply have to decide what your limit for accepting this behaviour is. Play along to your limit, then next. The danger to you is that… Read more »
One question that I feel didn’t really get answered was what does a potential future red pill aware society look like? I have no idea, but it’s fun to think about.
@Andy: The Big Sleep
“…the same way a slot machine feeds out small “wins” to keep you playing, even though your wins never come up to the level of your loses…
…She’s just another woman”
It’s amazing how accurate the women/slot machine analogy really is!
There’s always more slot machines in the casino.
Wait around long enough and they even take the older ones out and put new ones in!
Only bring in what you are willing to lose.
The house always wins.
However…you know how many other men have played that machine before you???
@kfg
“She’s not something to be conquered. She’s just another woman.”
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RFJs0sJzumY
Some general thoughts about the interview: Rollo brings up his lesser Alpha persona. I would be in praise of the lesser Alpha role in a LTR (of course I’m ego-invested in this). The lesser Alpha has an important by-product in the “lesser-dom” over a superior Alpha. That by product is stability. Rather than exponentially increasing his super alpha traits (hypergamously admired by women) and attraction cues, he reigns himself in a bit so as not to flame out. Stability in a LTR is a valuable commodity. More-so when in today’s times there are fewer quality women. If you have a… Read more »
@ kfg
Love the slot machine analogy, very apt. The pussy casino always wants house advantage, It’s my job not to concede it.
Great interview, very mature and professional , both voices worth a thousand pictures. Loved it when you talked (with bewilderment) about men still dreaming of virgins or about men still believe of women’s love. I think men must understand that women are ONLY capable of loving little boys . Loved it when you talked about Roosh. And I want to name him : a useful idiot . This useful idiot is completely lost (purposely)his way, his alliance with stormfront (on the Web only) against SJW ,leaves no room for his “neo masculinity” crusade. There is no “neo masculinity” and old… Read more »
“Love the slot machine analogy, very apt.”
It isn’t even entirely an analogy. It works by the very same psychological mechanism. At the Lizard Brain level we have a rather small number of stimulus/response mechanisms, no more than a lizard.
A good deal of our behaviour stems not from rational thought, but from rationalizing thought. We are the excuse making animal.
With all the emphasis on women’s ovulation SYSTEM, I can’t believe men still want women to love them.
Women’s love is an arousal love , you’re arousing! Bingo! She loves you.
Excellent questions; excellent responses – a very balanced conversation. Thank you.
.
The conjunction of the strip club facade and ROI was fascinating.
@kfg @play don’t pay Any thoughts on this dynamic? So there’s the message. You simply have to decide what your limit for accepting this behaviour is. Play along to your limit, then next. The danger to you is that the push/pull cycle is designed to get you to go past your limit, to create a sense of investment that you don’t want to abandon. This dynamic kfg describes is what Patrice O’Neal refers to as being her Time Ho. It can very rapidly spin out of control in to being her orbiter. For me, the moment a woman cuts me… Read more »
@anonim77 That phrase also is tricky for me, even though I had read Rollo’s post on it. All due respect to Rollo, for some people the term is not as easily understood by some for whom the concept is alien. I recently posted on here that it was a difficult concept for me to REALLY grasp, even though intellectually I did get the gist. That probably speaks volumes about me. Some people DON’T have the same issue grokking it. I appreciated Rollo revisiting it on the podcast because I think it helped me understand more even I was already making… Read more »
@Seraph
“Instead, I put up with shit and wasted my own time in consideration of everyone BUT me.”
That’s what drew me the red pill and I bet at least a dollar that I use to be that annoying guy at one point what got me over that is constant rejection. It helped more than hurt. I think if I knew of the red pill as a teenager I would have been less annoying and obnoxious.
But I am gratefull for learning and being able to whisper
Because I am a Man.
“It is about having life pursuits in the first place.” This is why I have on a number of occasions asked men what their mission was when they were in the 12 to 16 year old bracket. Almost every young man has some pursuit or five that occupies their mind and perhaps their time. Playing football, going fishing, riding dirt bikes, studying nature – but then those drives get lost in the race for rats and women, or even crushed out by forced service to mama’s imperative. Thinking back to what those important pursuits were when you were younger can… Read more »
@kfg
“And it’s interesting that for all the times I have asked it, I have yet to actually receive an answer.”
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fLx1zglbXTU
That’s something I’m going to journal about.
@kfg I personally never lost sight of my dream, even in my blue pill stupor. I pursued and achieved my dream of being a doctor which I had as weird as it sounds since I was 6. Needed 20 more years to do it, but it was done. What you end up having following that is a period of almost emptiness that you need to fulfill with new dreams and new goals and even more hobbies. Dreams can be re-evaluated even when achieved. Therefore, I would say a drive in a man’s life exists even within a marriage or whatever… Read more »
@Niko Choski: ” I pursued and achieved my dream of being a doctor which I had as weird as it sounds since I was 6.” I am an older man, so it doesn’t sound weird to me at all. In my own youth that was one of the big three dreams of boys, along with fireman and policeman. Then astronaut came along and made it four. My, how times have changed. As an aside, Google only lets me exist on YT as a ghost in the walls, so you won’t have seen me there, but I have followed you from… Read more »
One thing I get from the more extreme end of the MGTOW scene is that if a guy so much as considers altering his behavior, either genuinely or as a PUA ‘act’, he’s accused of “letting his little head do the thinking for the big head.” I don’t think I’m alone when I point out that the only time I’ve heard this actually stated, it universally came from the mouth of a woman. Women came up with this accusation in order to shame men into questioning their motives when it came to preferring a hotter, younger, more sexually available sexual… Read more »
Dreams can be re-evaluated even when achieved. Therefore, I would say a drive in a man’s life exists even within a marriage or whatever when they constantly create new dreams. Otherwise you do become very, very tired of living indeed. I would much rather have men have dreams independent of others. Such as dreams that they can achieve themselves,at least that creates a mindset of only achieving dreams that benefit you specifically. http://therationalmale.com/2011/10/31/perfecting-the-fantasy/ Wrote this a long time ago: Here’s a secret – there’s no such thing as contentment. Being content implies that life is static; it’s not, and to… Read more »
http://therationalmale.com/2011/11/04/taking-things-slow/ The nature of the Alpha guy that women crave pushes him to have sex, not wait for it. In fact that sexual insistence is a prime indicator that a woman is dealing with an Alpha. The man who’d agree to ‘taking it slow’ telegraphs Beta to her. Sexual impulsivity is an Alpha indicator that translates into a Man who insists on getting what he wants in other aspects of life – which benefits HER and her future offspring’s long term provisioning. In the long term, women want Men who other men want to be and other women want to… Read more »
Kewl “Why are my ovaries trying to make me cheat? I am in a happy relationship of three years. We have sex at least once a week which is fine for both of us. I can see myself staying with this guy indefinitely – he’s a fantastic man and a real keeper in so many ways. HOWEVER. Once a month, as reliably as clockwork, I ovulate, and All Hell Breaks Loose inside my head. For about 48 hours, all I can think about is sex, I cannot get it off my mind, and it is sex with ANYONE. It’s like… Read more »
“I don’t think I’m alone when I point out that the only time I’ve heard this actually stated, it universally came from the mouth of a woman.” In a former age it universally came from the mouths of older men, who invented the phrase. It was the prime directive of proto-red pill. It is illustrated in the final scene of The Maltese Falcon. “What I don’t think a lot of MGTOWs get . . .” A lot of men are never going to get it. Pick Up gathers more than its fair share of aspies, and MGTOW gathers more than… Read more »
“You do yourself no favors by desexualizing yourself.”
Of all the concepts of the current narrative, I think the idea of society “sexualizing women” drives me the craziest. The concept is self-cancelling, as the concept “women” only exists by sexualization.
Society doesn’t sexualize women, frickin’ biology does.
I just remembered a segment in the interview about the slut walk and women having the right to wear whatever they want and (BETA) men must not get aroused . Niko saying something like ;
The feminine imperative/ Hypergamy is making male’s sexual biology against the law ,well, I agree. But, don’t the MGTOW is suppressing their own sexual biology too?.
” . . . don’t the MGTOW is suppressing their own sexual biology too?.”
In the sense that choosing your diet is suppressing your energy biology.
We men have different strengths, interests, and psychological traits, Whether our reaction to red pill truths is competing harder, or resigned acceptance of AWALT, or MGTOW, etc, will depend on those differentiating factors. The core red pill truths will always be more interesting and useful than advocacy for any one of the possible reactions to such truths.
To me, MGTOW is a man who first and foremost, doesn’t place others before him. Getting into the seductive arts in fact teaches you to become this way, so all of us are MGTOW in some shape or form. I think what many men are using MGTOW for, is an excuse to simply not take the bull by the horns and actually change their circumstances. It’s not a solution in my opinion, because you’re essentially training to avoid your birth right, which is to seduce and bed beautiful women. It’s absolutely fine to be MGTOW once you’ve gone through the… Read more »
I can certainly understand the thinking behind MGTOW. Every emotionally painful experience in my life has been at the hands of a woman. Every one. (holy crap that sounds beta) Starting as a child when I was told I should be ashamed for having a penis, and that all men are rapists. Culminating with marrying, and having children with, the wrong woman. A woman who mentally abused everyone around her. BPD. My mother has chosen to stick with the BPD, and has discarded me. So why would I want to be around them? I would never go MGTOW, but I… Read more »
Hey “lurker” I have a novel concept. When you get all horny and shit? Jump your mans bones! I mean, if its all about getting the job done that should work. And sex once a week is OK/normal/good? ROFL. My idea of “good” is minimum 5 days a week. On the weekends I like to get twofers in, so we average about 6 romps a week, give or take a toss. And guess what? Neither my wife nor I suffer from “temptation” because my balls are empty, and her fuck tank is full. Of course, if your with a dude… Read more »
One of the things that Rollo discussed in the interview is internalization. To respond to things by who he is rather than trying to think of a red pill response to every interaction with women. Yeah, that’s a problem for me. Way too many times in my mind that thought comes to my head when interacting with women. It causes me to second guess everything I say or do especially if have any tinge of “niceness”. And yet, I’m not sure it really helped. It may have prevent me from being a doormat and being used, but… well… let me… Read more »
I think a man needs to be his own man above all. He should at least consider or mentally confront the world of women. I don’t think he actually has to prove he’s a stud, bed X number of women, to do that. Face it, some men are never going to be all that sexy. In today’s world, when women are placing a high value on men’s sexiness, the men that can’t achieve sexiness easily or at all are going to have a tough time with women. So if a man can rarely or never get laid, what’s he to… Read more »
Dreamer, internalization and being a natural and having agency is a factor of Mastery. Agency is the capacity of an agent (a person) to act in any given environment.
Mastery takes a while. So be patient. (Malcolm Gladwell’s “Outliers” threw out the number of 10,000 hours of passionate pursuit.)
It helps if you have good role models or mentors. And it takes faith that what you are striving for is congruent with who you want to be.
Patience requires time. I been around lurking around longer than you think – like reading posts in the SoSuave days. Back, I felt relief in stumbling on the information young and early – surely with such knowledge I would avoid falling to the same stumbles to the people. I’m read 10-20 years older than me. But as I go from way younger than the average reader to possibly the same age (though I thinker still younger than the average writer). But it seems Striver may have some truth for my experiences,
@Striver “Face it, some men are never going to be all that sexy. In today’s world, when women are placing a high value on men’s sexiness, the men that can’t achieve sexiness easily or at all are going to have a tough time with women. So if a man can rarely or never get laid, what’s he to do?” In the interview there is some discussion about how utilizing the services of professionals is a way of bypassing this performance burden, and it’s appealing to men because if you invest X amount of money, you know it’s a straightforward transaction… Read more »
@Striver & Vitriol: http://therationalmale.com/2012/01/09/services-rendered/ Too many guys think that it’s a numbers games and they’re only as successful in proportion to the amount of effort they’re willing to invest with the largest pool of women. It’s not a numbers game based on volume, it’s a persistence game. Any guy can hit up every girl in a club and go through 30 or 40 approaches in a weekend and get rejected every time and go “oh well, fuck it, this Game shit doesn’t work since my ROI is around 1% for all the approaches I made.” That kind of volume is… Read more »
Thanks for turning me on to Niko. The video he did after yours is also very good.
re: around 30 minutes into the interview, about isolationists: ———— I’ve had to isolate myself from my friends because of their attitudes about women. e.g.: “I don’t need to get laid. It doesn’t matter. You’re just a loser if you think having sex means anything.” He’s also said things to me like “why don’t you go after women who aren’t retarded,” in reference to me saying I wanted to start looking for girls that were 18-22 or around that age, the implication being that older women are more mature and intelligent and younger women are vapid/shallow/stupid and a ‘waste of… Read more »
@ tedd “And sex once a week is OK/normal/good? ROFL. My idea of “good” is minimum 5 days a week. On the weekends I like to get twofers in, so we average about 6 romps a week, give or take a toss. And guess what? Neither my wife nor I suffer from “temptation” because my balls are empty, and her fuck tank is full.” THAT’S what I’m talking about. Right on. I’ve been living small in my own mind. How much sex am I CAPABLE of having? A LOT. A real lot. Getting laid once a week would be a… Read more »
Also, not done listening to the interview yet, but great job. This is the best interview to date by a wide margin, IMO. Reminds me of a discussion I was having about Game the other day with a friend. Guys that aren’t in the know have the opinion that Game is for guys that ‘want to be macho, proving that they can sleep with a lot of women, look how hot I am, look how popular I am and how much better I am than other guys,’ etc… …(sigh)…. …I think I might’ve gotten through to him a little bit,… Read more »
@ Rollo Good advice on approaching. As a guy who’s just starting out with that, that’s very encouraging. Some of the PUA stuff I’ve been reading is like “You think a couple approaches a night is a lot? That’s a joke. You need to be making at least 100 approaches a week,” ….or something like that. Which kind of turned me off because it makes it feel like the bar for success is too insanely high to ever hope of reaching. Especially for a guy like me who’s new to Game and wanting to start applying this stuff in-field. I… Read more »
@Softek “Guys that are simply in denial about their sexuality, and try to justify their lack of success with women by claiming a moral high ground.” That’s the definitive version of my old self. “Beta Isolationists are in the worst situation — no skills with women AT ALL, afraid of even flirting, very little to no experience with sex, and then convincing themselves that they’re isolating themselves because they’re morally superior to other guys.” That’s hard to be around and most guys who are good with women don’t wanna hang around that ether least by observation. “You want to stand… Read more »
@SJF I’ll build on your comment about FI-defined traits for masculinity; only men can define what masculinity is. Full stop. We own the equipment, live with the male mindset, and see the world through male eyes. How any woman can tell a man to his face what “really” defines a man is just plain arrogance of the highest order. It’s “women-splaining” and don’t give it a second’s consideration. @ Sun Wukong Saw that “mood flip” so many times myself; the clinical ruthlessness with which you’re cut off after the cotton to you not playing their game never fails to surprise… Read more »
“But if you CAN’T get laid, and you know you can’t, and it isn’t a real option for you, then ‘choosing’ not to get laid isn’t really choosing not to get laid.”
Gandhi made the point that the weak cannot be non-violent. The “non-violence” of the weak is really just helplessness. If you wish to adopt the non-violent philosophy, the first thing you need to do is make yourself strong.
If you desire peace, prepare for war.
@Rollo Tomassi
I have a question Rollo. I’ve heard pick up artists say that for every 20-40 girls they approach, they get one girl to say yes. So if a man does 50 approaches in a year, doesn’t that mean he will only get one girl a year? Fuck! That’s not good.
I read a site called goodlooking loser and he says we should approach almost 100 girls to get one lay.
Havok, how many guys do you know who do 10 approaches a year? How many guys do you know who do 1 or 2 and then fixate on a particular girl, buy into her filibustering and / or LJBF schema with the first one to give them even a hint of interest? Who’s to say that the volume of approaches that PUA is making isn’t causing him to be less successful than making 1 or 2 solid approaches per weekend? Approaches and Game don’t happen in a vacuum. It’s not a formula to be repeated until you get a hit,… Read more »
Havoc: Did you see the piece in the thread of the previous article where a woman was talking about what she’s like in her ovulatory phase? What if you could identify women in that state and concentrate your efforts on them? A good tactician wins the battles because he understands the field of combat and only engages when the odds are substantially in his favor. You don’t have to play fair. Approaching also need not be as big a deal as some make it out to be. There are environments where you can approach 100 women a day, without any… Read more »
@Mikephil “but I guess to someone that traumatized, it may be the only way for them to cope. Sounds bleak, though.” It’s giving in which is giving up. I can’t change the past but I can keep doing better one step at a time. “Agent Jones: Only human.” “Morpheus: Welcome to the real world.” The red pill (counter Trauma I wish you more than luck) https://m.soundcloud.com/wholesum/this-is-water-by-david-foster @Rollo “It’s not a formula to be repeated until you get a hit, it’s an art, and to get good at art takes consistency.” That’s something I did last evening went out an approaching… Read more »
“Sex is the glue that holds relationships together.”
this, and…
you do not truly know a woman until you fuck her. a lot.
and she doesn’t truly know herself until you fuck her. a lot.
“You’re just a loser if you think having sex means anything.”
this is where the problem originates. guys think sex is something that you have/do.
no.
sex is something that you are.
people are verbs. I am fuck.
re: approaches Echoing what Rollo said: The idea of “make them come to you” rings very true here. When you pursue women that you know are interested in you by them giving off IOI’s (e.g. some sustained eye contact, checking you out, them acting a little nervous/shy, laughing at your jokes, if she approaches you instead of you approaching her, etc.) — your success rate will be much higher. If you’re just cold approaching completely random women your rejection rate is going to be a lot higher. The one friend I have IRL, who I see all the time, has… Read more »
“people are verbs. I am fuck.” Now there is something I have an objection to in currently popular MGTOW philosophy. They point out that only women are human beings, that men are human doings. They resent the burden of performance and wish to have the same social “respect” that is given to women, just for existing. But if you are not a human doing, you are a vegetable. They are on the right track not when they deserve more respect for men, but when they demand less for women. And, as Jack Donovan points out, a point which used to… Read more »
Its one thing to define masculinity. It’s another thing to be better at being a masculine male that is admired and respected by others esp. in inter-sexual relationships. Keeping Frame and striving for masculine self-improvement does not equal having power or Mastery (……Just ask Softek……..) Striver and Vitriol seem to be expressing in comments here their difficulty of “Getting Through the Stages.” http://therationalmale.com/2012/07/25/the-5-stages-of-unplugging/ “1. Denial – Still Plugged -In: “These game guys are a bunch of clowns, there’s no way this works on women. Women aren’t stupid. What a bunch of misogynists.” 2. Anger – Post-Red Pill: “This is ridiculous!… Read more »
@ Rollo “Approaches and Game don’t happen in a vacuum. It’s not a formula to be repeated until you get a hit, it’s an art, and to get good at art takes consistency.” There it is. As far as art goes, too, understanding your subject is important. This is not a Game/PUA blog, but reading RM has helped my interactions with women a LOT. You stop doing shit with women that doesn’t make sense once you understand how they operate. Blue Pill/Beta “Game,” after all, is based on a FALSE premise of how women work, and what turns them on.… Read more »
The last time I approached a woman, I was 26, I’m 33 now. Isolation isn’t a bad thing. It takes a certain type of person to be ok with it and strive. Like most things, it isn’t for everyone. If I see a cute chick and have the choice of talking to her or not, why am I “less of a man/not living life to the fullest” when I pass on the opportunity? Talking to a random stranger, be it man or woman, isn’t on my to do list on my daily outings. It’s my time, my life and only… Read more »
@LonePlanet, read these two posts: http://therationalmale.com/2014/07/15/separating-values/ http://therationalmale.com/2014/07/23/case-study-low-expectations/ You are making the common feminine conflation of personal worth and your own SMV. I don’t think you’re “less of a man” because of your choice not to engage with women. I do however understand that you have retarded your personal experience with women for the past 7 years. There are a majority of 33 y.o. men right now who have learned things about women by engaging them since they were 26 that you, by choice or necessity, have not. Those are the simple facts. As to whether that makes you a better… Read more »
Softek – understand something. Before I found the sphere I spent about 6 years of a 12 year marriage sexless. Clinically sexless by definition in fact. When I found myself looking at a second marriage, I made it perfectly clear that I view sex as THE important facet of my marriage. Not in an overt “fuck me or I’ll leave” way. I just made sex a priority in our relationship from day 1. And not to brag, but the truth is we average 5-6 romps a week. I always go for twofers on the weekends. The best part is when… Read more »
@Havok Another way to look at it: learning game is like learning music: playing jazz clarinet, say. You get exercises, you learn the mechanics: how to play scales, how to read the melody, practicing arpeggios, etc. But to get somewhere with it, you actually have to start PLAYING. No you don’t get the Birdland gig your first time out. Maybe not for some time. You can’t base success on how long it takes for you to start getting paid to play, or how much you get per gig as you get started. You keep at it, by keeping at it… Read more »
@Fred, never forget, there is nothing I haven’t already written about:
http://therationalmale.com/2011/08/31/learning-to-play/
“Your path is yours to walk, no one elses.”
On a path I ride daily there are others walking and riding it. I am required to make approaches by natural law, because I am the fastest motherfucker on the path and need them to get the hell out of my way for my own safety.
Well, as William S. Burroughs used to say, “a word to the wise guy.”
Burroughs stayed out of my way quite well. When he was in Mexico, I was in NY. When I was in NY, he was in Mexico.
Not all of his “crowd” were quite so accommodating. I did rather like Dave Amram though.
“Do you realize that this decision has limited you from the experience . . .” Whatever experience you are having right now is limiting you from other experiences. You cannot escape the burden of choice of performance. When people first asked me if the things I have done were worth the sacrifices, I didn’t understand that the hell they were talking about. I did what I did because it was what I wanted to be doing. Not doing it in order to have the experiences they apparently wanted me to have had would have been the sacrifice. I haven’t the… Read more »
Tedd,
“One of the reasons I post less online is I have very little to complain about. For me being here is about keeping my chops sharp and my head in the game. And occasionally helping a brother out.”
I have come to join your club in the last two months. Prior to two months ago my pressure of speech was embarrassing me. I’m really in a good place with my situation now thanks to TRM and Rollo.
“Now the operative question is why haven’t you approached a woman for the last 7 years? Do you realize that this decision has limited you from the experience of interacting intimately with women at a time in your life that you will never have the opportunity for again?”
I am an artist, baker, & musician. I have created businesses in all three. That’s what I’ve been doing for the past 7 years.
Interacting with women has become an afterthought. I put 100% of myself into these creations. Blood, sweat & years. There isn’t any room for the “fairer” sex.
Rollo, can we buy an audio of your lecture?
Great interview, best one so far, Niko is an excellent host. The passage relating to strippers and McLuhan’s ‘the medium is he message’ was particularly enlightening, never thought to extrapolate it to that forum. I’ve always had the inclination strip joints were sad places and the interview reinforced that opinion. Men will pay for simulated faux female intimacy, the fact that the stripper is conveying it to multiple men simultaneously just shows the depths of the male desire for female intimacy. It’s such a vast topic and sadly McLuhan died before the internet age, I would love to have heard… Read more »
“Female Viagra”
Addyi
officially approved by the FDA
August 18, 2015
@SJF “A free masculine male is a man who cannot be squeezed into doing something he would otherwise never do. A powerful man is one that can control the outcome of his efforts.” In rugby today we went over some things. Obstacle = opportunity Grow mindset- intelligence and talent can go up and down. Add YET Fixed mindset- intelligence and talent are fixed at birth Your not a finished product Lose/interpretation/perspective determine Attitude Bounce forward 30% positive words in dictionary 20% neutral and 50% negative Accept thoughts without judgement Useful self talk Take action win the moment. Glad to be… Read more »
@Matt
Copy the link into the bar here
http://www.listentoyoutube.com
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWwSPpJ5axs
Sure you can donate on the website a fee you deem fit.
Hey, just listened to the whole interview over my friend’s place. He’s the first and only friend I’ve shared this stuff with and was receptive to it, aside from the natural Alpha I’ve mentioned so much. That was pretty cool. The part about being deprived of a natural human experience scared the shit out of me. I’ve known that ever since I was 14 and really got into girls, and was desperate to be with them, but never had any experiences. So it wasn’t a ‘startle’ scare, but just a reminder of how serious my situation is, and how imperative… Read more »
@ rugby11ljh
Thanks.
Art:
Logo design, painting, graffiti art.
Baking:
Cakes mostly.
Music:
Hip Hop beats/production (not that lil wayne sounding crap, more like Madlib, DJ Premier, Aesop Rock). I also play a little bass, guitar & piano, not well, but enough to get the job done.
“We’re only screwing ourselves by thinking that we’re in some way above sexuality in some lame self-delusion that in stating so will make us more desirable and set us apart from the rest of the herd (who are also claiming to be above sex anyway).” So, you’re standing across from the 300, who are about to make their way to the pass at Thermopylae. You remind them that they’re only screwing themselves by denying their desire to continue living. Their belief that it would be more honorable to die in defense of their city than live in cowardice and supplication… Read more »
@Lucien, don’t LARP here. http://therationalmale.com/2011/11/28/humanism-behaviorism-and-the-amorality-of-game/ Every vice you can point a negative finger at operates in precisely in this dynamic. Our morality, our intelligence, our sexuality and the behaviors that are manifested by them are all motivated by this base. It would be a pleasant fiction if we could all remove our consciousness from this and be these enlightened, self-actualized beings, constantly operating in a state of peak experience, but this damn testosterone in my body keeps pulling me back down to earth. It may be morally reprehensible for a woman to break her marriage commitment, divorce her husband and… Read more »
Reading people’s comments on MGTOW attitudes makes me extremely frustrated and uncomfortable. That’s how I know they are probably on to something. Sigh. I have years of insecurity and inadequacy built up that come out every single time a girl looks in my direction. That’s the honest truth. I remembered that when hearing the guy’s story above about the hottest girl in the room coming up to him after a concert. I know I would simply wither under those circumstances, for exactly the reason he said — I just don’t believe that I deserve a girl like that. And I… Read more »
I wonder if Rollo realizes how much of an impact his writings have on the MGTOW community, and how describing the reality of alpha fucks/beta bucks, hypergamy, The Wall, etc, lead to the “juice is not the squeeze” mentality. I do believe isolationism is probably dangerous, but MGTOW need not mean isolationism and giving up on life, IMO. It need not even mean giving up on women and the pleasures of their company, but it does mean giving up being a romantic. Thing is that I believe a great deal of men have a hard time giving up romanticism and… Read more »
I think I will post here rather than the current latest post. As while related, the topic fits better the current flow here. Taking from somedudebro’s post. Rollo Tomassi – intentional or not – does give a sense of giving up. Rollo Tomassi have strongly insisted that he does not advocate giving up, but the points made does give a sense. For a while I stop reading here because all I feel when I read here many times is giving up. I put it like this, I think a major aspect when interacting with people means having some level of… Read more »
@Dreamer, read this:
http://therationalmale.com/2014/09/29/a-new-hope/
Learn this now, you will never achieve contentment or emotional fulfillment in a blue pill context with red pill awareness.
It took me a bit to figure what you mean when post that link as a response to mine. Correct me if I misunderstood you, you are reading that I am demotivated of losing a blue pill type of hope. Maybe. But I guess I have ask you, for in my mind I think the hopeless feel is hopeless a red pill type of contentment. Or at least I think it’s red pill. In the link, one of the lines you said is women can and do love men deeply. Your context around that line was talking about the blue… Read more »
Wexlers: One thing id like to add that i think would help clear up the blurred line between the basic distinction of alpha/beta: its subjective, and depends on the girl observing the guys behavior
^^^
Don’t you think that not only girls are validating men being beta or alpha -but also other males ?
[…] Niko Choski […]
Niko Choski and Rollo Tomassi Thanks…you two talking, giggling together…made me see my own error more clearly. I forget sometimes…but I never ..now..make the fundamental error that you cling to as fervently as life itself. Division…the ‘them and us’ ..we belong…we are safe…thing. ……The sense of personal annihilation, that has to be defeated, in order to recognise ones ‘self’ ..quite alone….sans any ‘us’? You havnt made it yet. You two hold on, as if you are mid ocean, somewhere off Cape Horn in a storm.. to your water wings of Masculine Identity. In that…you can cling ‘together’..and be ‘safe’.. It… Read more »
@Roche
Projecting much?
How many ”fuckin kids”… (Your own quote)…have you abandoned…or simply dismissed as the responsibility of your one night shag? The gal you would not even have talked to if you had been sober..? The gal you’ve forgotten her name, The gal you did not want anything to do with.. after an uninteresting sex session? The gal who in so many different ways…was a louse, a bitch, a cunt from hell…etc etc? …how many kids have YOU left in the charge of those women.. while you think and dream about the pleasure due…to your own dick? While you dream of your… Read more »
Zero.
[…] solipsistic nature is manifested in their communication style, and as fate would have it I received a fresh comment from a new female commenter on my interview with Niko Choski. I wont bore you with the histrionics […]
Rollo,
Thought you might like this article about Ernest Hemingway and when he was in love with his wife and mistress – for all his reputation as an ultra Alpha, he comes off as very beta in love.
From the Smithsonian magazine
http://www.smithsonianmag.com/arts-culture/ernest-hemingway-in-love-180956617
BK
@Roche
I use protection. I am sure the women I slept with if they had any children with myself would come knocking. And the state would assist them at that.
🙂