One thing I really enjoy about doing the few interviews I’ve done is that they allow me to do a stream of consciousness dialog with another person. I like this because it’s very close to the internal dialoging I do when I’m writing notes or researching a topic. While I was talking with Christian McQueen last week the topic of respect came up and I riffed on this for a bit.
“Be with a woman that admires you… admiration creates a different kind of respect”
I’ve delved into the dynamic of respect in the past, but what I was getting at with this was the ways in which women and men differ in their views of respect. Towards the close of last weeks post I made mention of Girl With A Dragonfly Tattoo’s post on the womanly art of seduction. What I found interesting in her list of seductive qualities was that these aren’t really means of seduction, but rather mindsets women should adopt to maintain a healthy relationship.
As I mentioned in that post, women’s methods of seduction are a lost art, but those means lack real significance if there is no genuine desire for that man. Women can very easily seduce men today. So starved for intimate attention are the majority of men that they create the seductive narrative for themselves; all a woman need do is make it easy for him to believe.
On a woman’s part, seduction doesn’t require much. There was a time I did some investigation into the profiles of professional online escorts. I had followed some links Advocatus Diaboli had offered in a few of his posts about his dealing with escorts, and while there were the prerequisite “pros’ with pornstar bodies and manners to match, the majority of these women were semi-attractive “amateurs” you’d be surprised by if you saw them in casual clothes. These women tended to be in their 30s-40s but what was telling was how each gal sold herself to potential clients.
To the average frustrated husband or sexless mature man I have no doubt these women were like a tall glass of water in the desert. By my own standards they were average, but what I noticed was each woman’s profile offered some variation of “you’ve worked hard, isn’t it time you enjoyed the appreciation you deserve?”, “let me treat you the way you should be appreciated” or “you’ve earned a good time with a woman who knows how to please her man.”
For part-time semi-pro escorts I was impressed by how well they knew their demographic. My guess is more than a few were divorced, but found their ‘niche’ so to speak once they were set up with spousal support. Each of them sold themselves based on at least the feigned mindset which Girl With A Dragonfly Tattoo proposed women (wives) adopt to seduce their men (husbands).
In that list the first of the two articles stood out the most:
Admiration
Virtually all men crave a woman who admires him. A woman who will listen to him when he’s talking about something he finds interesting, or when he’s giving his opinion. They want a woman who will be interested and fascinated with what he says – yes, I said fascinated. It turns them on to be in the presence of a hot woman (his wife) who is also giving him her entire attention and the right kind of feedback that says, “You are such an interesting man! Omg I want you! Now!!!”
When was the last time you reacted to your husband like that? I know… us wives are ridiculously tired, over-achieving, too much to do, have kids hanging off our legs at any moment when we’re at home (or out… at the store trying to deal with a meltdown). I understand, I’m a wife and mother of two now. But guess what? Your husband craves this kind of thing, and if this need is met by you, he will move mountains to ensure your happiness.
Of these two, admiration is the most important. Feigned admiration is the stripper’s secret (as well as the semi-pro escort’s). To the man unused to genuine admiration (that is to say 80%+ of them) this becomes his worst thumbscrew and source of manipulation. Sexual ‘thirst’ is certainly a factor, but men inherently realize the sexual attraction value that a woman’s admiration represents for themselves.
Part of men’s conditioning is recognizing the effect that simple social proof to overt fame has on women. Smart men figure out how to leverage this to their advantage as a part of Game, but most are so starved of that admiration that even marginal displays from women are enough to convince him her intents are genuine.
Truth or Compliments
Private Man had an interesting post regarding his tweet on compliments from women:
My response was thus:
“Compliments = IOIs (Indicators Of her Interest in the man). 80%+ of men are Betas, thus compliments are a rare. Can’t have Betas get the wrong ideas.”
Compliments are considered an expression of admiration for men, but largely supplication for women. In the past I’ve gone into detail about how compliments for women need to be sparse because, for the greater part of women, compliments have very little value to them. In an age of social media and ‘quick-hit ego boosts’ from her girlfriends and symps, compliments are common.
What’s scarce is valuable, so the rare compliment from a high-value Alpha is a solid reinforcer for a woman – from a Beta compliments are a liability; they are an overt expression of interest from a man she has very little interest in beyond his utility to her.
For that same reason, women giving compliments to men they have no genuine admiration for also becomes a liability – even if that liability is just implied to herself. Ergo, women rarely express admiration for a man they genuinely have no true admiration of – it’s too risky. This is why women must be taught (as in Girl With A Dragonfly Tattoo’s post) to be conscious of, and attentive to, delivering compliments to men they’ve committed to, but regard as Beta. Left to their natural impulses women simply avoid complimenting men they have no desire to be held accountable to.
Private Man asks:
What’s wrong with reinforcing a man’s confidence through a compliment? Women adore confident men. The compliment is the opposite of the shit test where a woman tests the mans adversity by artificially creating that adversity by herself.
Not to run him up the flagpole (I have a deep respect for PM), but Private Man answers his own question inadvertently. Women do adore confident men, but by definition a confident man wouldn’t need any reinforcement of that confidence. Once again, women want a man who ‘Just Gets It‘. Any (Alpha) man a woman has a genuine admiration of doesn’t need a confidence boost from her – in fact that boost, and the implied need of it, only raises Hypergamous doubt for her.
Just as with the differing concepts of love and communication, men tend to presume that their concept of admiration is the universal one. The aspects and considerations men base their admiration of other men on are not the same that women use for men. I outlined this a bit in Hysteria, but there is a uniquely female precondition of unqualified social proof women entertain for themselves as a component to their arousal that men (at least heterosexual ones) don’t have for other men.
In other words men who women are unfamiliar with are an unverified commodity to women with regard to arousal / attraction. As you can see in the videos I linked in Hysteria, this unfamiliarity with a man’s real social value (and associated SMV) are easily mimicked when they control the environment and situation. It’s this unfamiliarity and a want to believe in the possibility that a man may possess fame or even simple third-party social esteem that leads to an easy admiration for a man women have just met or are only casually familiar with.
Imaginings
Women’s imagination is one of the best tools in a man’s Game toolbox, but this is so because Hypergamous doubt is also Hypergamous prospect. The same Hypergamy that predisposes a woman to opportunistic sexual strategy also drives her imaginings about its potential fulfillment by unfamiliar men. It’s far easier for a woman to imagine she should admire a man she doesn’t know than for her to appreciate a man she’s already intimately familiar with anything close to that same admiration.
This is what men idealistically want to believe about admiration coming from their wives and long-time girlfriends – that it’s just as sincere as the expressions of admiration, the compliments and inspiration, she’s naturally disposed to give to men she’s unfamiliar with, even when that man was himself when they first met. Compliments and admiration are less believable, not to mention far less forthcoming, when a woman is aware of the person you “really” are in an LTR because hypergamous prospect turns to hypergamous doubt.
As I mention in Frame, the dominant frame you establish and enter into a relationship with sets the tone for that relationship. Sincere admiration and genuine desire are key components to setting that frame before you enter into an LTR or marriage. You will never experience a more sincere admiration from a woman than while you are single and uncommitted. Her imagination fills in the blanks for her perception of you because you represent the potential of fulfilling her sexual strategy (either Alpha Fucks or Beta Bucks). Once you are committed and a woman has had those blanks filled in by her familiarity with you, admiration and compliments (if any) become something women need to be taught and reminded are something they ought to maintain to keep men interested in them by necessity.
If there is no admiration expressed from a woman while you’re single, or you’ve got to fish for compliments, or you’ve got to plead your case to her that you are someone she should admire, never enter into any kind of commitment with her.
Girl With A Dragonfly Tattoo’s next article of seduction was respect:
Respect
How many men crave respect? All of them. They want to be known as the leader of their house, they want their wives to defer to them for decisions – but they want their wives to genuinely do it out of the feeling of respect, not just half-heartedly ask their husbands what they think, but to let them know that they are expressly interested in their husband’s response because of who he is.
They want a woman who looks up to them – who doesn’t try to outshine them or put them down – but who greatly esteems them and their opinions on matters (this ties in directly with Admiration). They don’t want a wife who will constantly argue and bicker with them over decisions and details, or one who challenges them and their headship constantly.
Respect amongst men and respect amongst women are, again, two differing concepts. GWADT describes her impression of what she perceives men would want in terms of respect from their spouses, but this outline ignores the basic principles of the Desire Dynamic – respect is valueless if it’s an obligation, you cannot negotiate a genuine respect. Men understand this because respect between men is something that is earned, whereas constant social conditioning makes respect for women something to be expected.
Respect for a woman is a given and as such, like compliments, it becomes so cheap a commodity to women they have no concept that it means something entirely different amongst men. In fact, Blue Pill conditioned men are so socially insaturated in a default “respect” for women that it’s become an article of Beta Game among them. Properly trained White Knights make a competition of “out-respecting” one another with their declarations of respecting women. They believe it sets them apart from “other guys” who don’t respect women and thus make them uniquely in touch and identifying with what they’ve been taught women want.
The next time you see some self-evincing meme declaring “a real gentleman does X for a woman” posted on Facebook by one of your Blue Pill friends you’ll understand how valueless the term respect really is to women. I hit on this in my post Respect:
Masculine Respect
So this is my point, women don’t respect men, or rather, they don’t respect the masculine – and most certainly don’t have a default respect for it. They’re taught to be adversarial, not cooperative. Women are taught to relinquish respect, and then only begrudgingly when a man has proven his quality beyond the reach of most men. Masculinity is popularly ridiculed in western culture as it is, but to respect a man is to compete with him, to out-masculine him. Cooperation or even recognizing that the genders could be complimentary is viewed at best as antiquated, at worst, sublimation to the male imperative.
Women have very little incentive for learning to defer to a man with a default respect when respect for women is already a social entitlement – that is the frame of reference women have with respect. Even average fathers seldom experience an organic respect from their daughters unless they are taught (usually by example) to appreciate the qualities that make him respectable. Women in the workplace presume they’re being treated with a default professional respect, but any respect that’s afforded them generally begins with that default ‘Respect for Women’® dynamic that 80%+ of men already believe is their due.
When men express respect for other men it’s usually because they’ve in some way earned it or earned a respectable office. That’s not always the reality, but it is the general presumption that respectable men are “leaders of their house” (business, position, team or rank) and makers of the decisions others follow because they have earned it. Think about the men you genuinely respect. Why do you respect them? What have they done to merit your deference of respect to them?
The way a man considers these aspects differs from how a woman considers these aspects. Respectable Men are keenly aware of a respect offered to them due to obligation as opposed to a genuine, considerate and introspective respect. So when a woman who presumes she holds a default authority humbles herself, and magnanimously allows a man she’s told she should respect a degree of deference, that man understands it’s her obligation and not a genuine respect he’d experience from other men.
Indeed, men do want a woman who looks up to them, admires them and respects them, but too many men don’t recognize the motivators behind women expressing them. Many Beta men make a joke out of their wives being “the real boss” or how she “puts up with him.” They have no concept, much less any expectation, of an organic, uncoerced masculine admiration, respect or even a compliment, so it’s no surprise when they can’t discern between a real expression of sincerity and one motivated by manipulation or obligation.
Lastly, ladies, the best compliment you can give a man is with your body and consideration. Unexpected gestures, being an imaginative lover, staying in shape because you want to please a man, are the best expressions of genuine desire, admiration and respect. Nothing conveys real appreciation for a man better than the unsolicited desire you reserve for Alpha Fucks. You want him to know you admire and respect him? Initiate sex with him, often and with intensity.
April 9th, 2015 at 1:11 am
“be with a woman that admires you” Easy, they all fit this initially, you just gotta dump em before they can’t keep up the facade.
April 9th, 2015 at 4:20 am
On what page can we discuss parts of the Preventive Medicine book?
April 9th, 2015 at 9:02 am
Over time a woman’s admiration turns into resentment. I’ve had girls who admired me suddenly start shit-testing and putting me down…only because I’m successful or popular in front of them.
I’m not sure what that is…fear of losing me so they try to destroy me?
April 9th, 2015 at 11:22 am
@walawala
From my experience (as a young man), the longer you can stay elusive to her, keep her guessing, stay mysterious, the longer her admiration will last, and the harder (but more pleasantly) she’ll try to crack your code. Once you’ve dished out all your coolness, they begin searching for additional facets through shit-testing. If you come up empty, they lose interest, increase the shit test intensity, because they don’t want to not be enthralled with you, they want it.. and they can’t stay in love (initially) without it. So, don’t give up all your diversity up front. Whenever possible, along the way, show something cool about yourself to her, instead of telling her about it.
I do think there’s a threshold you cross right around the first or second time she gives it to you, where you can then take a breather, and not have to work so hard.. you’ve qualified (temporarily), and she’ll go easy on you for a while. But don’t rest too long.. you have to (without her prompting), spice it up again through your unique coolness, somehow, without taking too long a reprieve.
This is one aspect I don’t see covered a lot in the game blogs. Amused Mastery sort of fits, because it’s about presenting yourself as someone who knows/understands way more than he’s expressing with words, just by using a confident swagger. This in itself keeps her wondering, why is this guy so cool? even though you’re not really even telling her anything about yourself, you’re just projecting this.. “Throw what ever you want at me babe, and prepare to tingle or even cream at my response.” attitude. I think this causes her shit tests to take on a different, sort of softball tone, in a way, cuz she wants you to knock it out of the park.
April 9th, 2015 at 11:49 am
@Tuffluv
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=lgSLz5FeXUg
Helps keep things out of perfection
Idealism vs opportunitism
Show don’t tell
Perform
Never reveal to much about yourself
Hard work build a mystery about yourself.
Let her figure you out.
(That video always stuck with me growing up)
April 9th, 2015 at 11:53 am
Women view narcissistic men as suitable partners:
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S019188691500210X
April 9th, 2015 at 12:20 pm
lh
“If you get that admiration and respect from women, you’ll grow Alpha traits automatically while the lack of those is the fuel for betaisation. The influence will be the more powerful the more you love her, the deeper the connection is. After making some experience with that, I’ll immediately next any women where her view of mine will pull me down instead of pushing me up. It’s just too unhealthy.
Adding to my comment above, I’d even state the famed “Natural” is just a man who got that admiration from women early as a child from family, mothers, sisters etc. and then build himself a flow of it.”
I think you are right, in both your comments. The beta can possibly become more alpha by being admired, respected, desired, felt addicted to, etc. but realistically, I don’t think many women do that for a beta husband/man. If a woman reads my post and she is married to a beta that repulses her (or an alpha she effectively turned into a beta), I think she will be angry at the suggestions, because (when it comes down to it) it’s the husband being a beta that makes her not admire and desire him like she would the Alpha Fucks that give her a spark. She doesn’t want to have to pretend, and that is what a lot of marriage counseling tries to tell women to do (which is why most of it just doesn’t work). A wife pretending to feel those things, may MAY actually start feeling them for real, but getting her to pretend them in the first place would be very hard. That isn’t my motive anyway.
Most women were never taught how to respect masculinity. I write to Gen Y women and younger girls to try to get them to understand men… things they were never taught. That’s what I like about your second comment (above). Little boys are very much alpha in their natural states, it is (in my opinion) society and feminization that gets them to become more beta into adulthood. I agree wholeheartedly that a Natural is just a man who got that specific admiration and respect of his masculinity from women early as a child, and then grew into it. That is what we do in our family with our oldest son. We have always appreciated his masculinity, but he from the beginning, had a strong desire to be just like his dad in all things! We just encouraged it and praised him, teased him, etc. He knows he’s handsome, smart, and strong – we as parents have given him that feedback. We weren’t trying to feminize him, or like some moms I’ve seen, make him stay clean (they won’t let their sons play in the dirt). He’s a boy, and he’s known the full aspect of enjoying that difference.
Since most women were never taught to respect masculinity, they don’t get my list of things that seduce men. If my post makes those women feel uncomfortable, good, that is what hearing truth does. I write primarily for Gen Y, I could care less about the women Gen X and up who chose betas they could control, that they detest. But if I make them angry then that’s fine with me.
Boys want to be noticed for being strong, brave, etc. girls want to be noticed for being beautiful (or in the past, virtuous)… these are differences in the sexes that have until recently, been appreciated. Now we have feminists writing books about the “Beautiful Boy” where boys are trying to be seen as beautiful, and girls are trying to be seen as tough, independent, bossy.
April 9th, 2015 at 12:56 pm
walawala: “I’m not sure what that is…fear of losing me so they try to destroy me?”
Sometimes they self-sabotage simply to assert the only control they feel they have. I’ve even had it happen on first dates when a woman thinks I’m out of her league, or has too much attraction but is focused on her prior serial failures.
April 9th, 2015 at 1:28 pm
@phantom26d
Definition of game:
Confidence + Action = Game
Have the confidence to go after the things you want;
Have the self-esteem to believe you will achieve your goals;
Visualize yourself succeeding in your goals;
Have the dedication to master the skills/knowledge that will help you achieve your goals;
Act. Achieve your goals. Then set new, higher ones.
Often, this will apply to females, but if you really pay attention to what Rollo, CH, etc. are saying, you will see pussy is a by-product, not the goal. Power is the goal. Woman do not want to be the goal, they will respect you less if you make them the goal.
To me “game” really is the perfect word for this whole process/theory/application because it reminds you foremost it is a GAME. And what is a game really? It’s something FUN! Something to pass the time, to challenge your skills, hopefully makes you improve your skills. It is not “work” it is “play.” At least it is if you are doing it right. When I think of game I literally see the playground in elementary school. A boy walks up to a girl and pulls her hair. Now she knows he “likes” her. The girl feigns anger/frustration, but really what you see is she is intrigued. They chase each other. These two are engaging the oldest dance that Homo Sapien has ever known. I think nature made it like this so we would have to “think” about it. Just like nature tells you when you have to piss or makes you feel sick when you eat certain things, nature makes your dick hard for SUPERIOR women. All you have to do to get that chick is DHV. Display the fact that you are a SUPERIOR Man and watch the legs spread. Watch them rationalize the one stand for you. Watch them justify your bad behavior. Its that easy. And, its that hard. But that is what makes it worth it. If it was easy, every loser faggot would be piping a supermodel and their weak genes would make weaklings and the whole goddamn race of man would die off in a few generations.
The whole purpose of life for men is sex to propagate with SUPERIOR women. The whole purpose of life for Women is to bear the children of a SUPERIOR Man. Sex for pleasure in the modern age can be enjoyed without the fear of pregnancy, but the same rules are still hardwired in us as if we were still cavemen. The man with SUPERIOR genetics wants to pass those genes on with a woman of SUPERIOR genetics (hot people want to fuck hot people, news at 11). All women, whether superior or not, WANT to pass on the genes of a SUPERIOR MAN. All men, whether superior or not, WANT to pass on their genes to a SUPERIOR woman. Nature is cruel; it does not give a shit who is picked last for the team or which girls never got asked to dance. The weak are meant to die, the strong are meant to survive. This is the way of nature. The greatest gift you have as a man is the ability to raise your SMV. You don’t have to end up where you started. Well, some will. And for those poor fucks, tough luck.
Therefore all of dating, all of “game” is really just a woman deciding whether a man is SUPERIOR, and therefore worthy of impregnating her. The modern man and woman do not need to be aware or conscious of these things; hell most blue pillers actively believe they are “evolved” beyond this kind of shit. But they aren’t. REAL Attraction is chemical. Like eyes meeting across the room and then you’re making out 30 seconds later. It is not just for super drunk people. It’s a real thing. In the moment, attraction has nothing to do with money or provisioning. It has to do with eyes, with body language, touch.
This 3 second video demonstrates everything I just wrote and all of game theory. Amazing.
https://heartiste.wordpress.com/2015/04/08/the-essence-of-game-condensed-to-a-three-second-video/
April 9th, 2015 at 1:49 pm
@Dragonfly
A wife pretending to feel those things, may MAY actually start feeling them for real, but getting her to pretend them in the first place would be very hard.
Won’t happen for two reasons.
1) In the scenario you’re describing, she is leading him to a more Alpha state. That’s just going to reinforce her view of him as a man that can’t lead and can’t be in charge.
2) Since he’s just following her lead, he’s going to stop where she stops. He won’t “Just Get It” and take over ever. As much as I hate to say it, it takes straight up losing the woman for most of us guys raised Beta to finally get it through our skulls that we should be killing the Beta.
I mean I would say as it goes for Beta, I probably had more Alpha potential than most of my friends. I tended to lead naturally amongst peer groups, I’ve never been afraid of speaking my mind and offending people (even women I’ve been with), and I’ve always just done what I wanted regardless of what most people say… until I was dealing with a female shit test. At that point I’d cave.
It took losing a lot of women over the years and finally a woman I really seriously thought I was going to spend the rest of my life with to finally “get it”.
If a dude made it to adulthood as a Beta, the woman that should have been respecting his masculinity to build an Alpha missed the window. From then on it’s just a crapshoot on each loss if he’s finally going to get the clues necessary to kill the Beta. Most dudes never will. Following a woman’s lead will never get him there though.
I think your post supposes a demographic that doesn’t exist: women who want to (and can) turn their Beta in to an Alpha. It’s worse than a unicorn; it’s a divide by zero. That shit don’t happen in our universe.
April 9th, 2015 at 1:58 pm
Joe Katzman, thank you for the link. I just downloaded Ana Karinina for the grand price of 99 cents off of Amazon.
April 9th, 2015 at 2:25 pm
The women that admired me where the ones I hurt. The ones I treated like shit. Upon reflection, the more I wanted to give, the more repulsive I became. The more familiar. The more generous. Than I was disgusting.
Mexican girl I dated when I was young. I would screw her on the street. In public buildings. She was mad after me. Then came the Epiphany phase. I met her years after and she was all Betabux betabux. I was a threat. But boy I could tell she wanted a good screw. Such strange shit.
I forget what true admiration is. But, if they fuck you anytime anywhere maybe.
Also, if they are women not bastardized Barb wire tough independent bitches.A woman that admires gives.
Familiarity also breeds contempt. I dated and after a few months they treat me like shit. Back to Dread. Or vanish. Strange again. New set of rules.
I have a simple test now with my wife. I start a fight. Or just piss her off. She always puts the brakes and stops me. She lets me know she respects me. She then wants to fuck…Hahaha. Try it guys. Not everyday of course.
April 9th, 2015 at 2:45 pm
Those of you asking about game.
Met an 87 year old farmer. Arguing with his wife. Hell of an argument. She stormed off.
I asked him if the shit ever ends. He said:
Boy set them rules from the first day. When you first say hello you better let that woman know how it’s gone be. It says so in the good book. I fucked up. Look at me now. Arguing and fussing 60 years later! You better let your woman know the rules or you hit the road.
Now that’s game for you guys.
April 9th, 2015 at 2:45 pm
admiration is the parting of the thighs.
respect is the convulsions of the hips.
April 9th, 2015 at 2:47 pm
“The beta can possibly become more alpha by being admired, respected, desired, felt addicted to, etc. but realistically, I don’t think many women do that for a beta husband/man.”
Not possible for any woman to do so. By definition “beta” is never respected. That’s why we call them beta, now isn’t it?
“or an alpha she effectively turned into a beta”
Also not possible. That’s why we call them alpha. It is not possible for a man who runs his life to be manipulated by any woman.
Genuine respect and admiration cannot be used in a frivolous masquerade to facilitate bribery. However, their faked substitutes can be as Dragonfly demonstrates.
April 9th, 2015 at 3:05 pm
“The beta can possibly become more alpha”
“an alpha she effectively turned into a beta”
I, I, I, I, I, I, I’ve, I, I, I…
Genuine masculinity is not dependent upon any woman who appoints herself to the defense of it.
April 9th, 2015 at 3:08 pm
I’m coming to the suspicion that women’s revulsion towards Beta male psychology, personality and behaviors is an evolved instinct.
There is a female hindbrain, limbic sensitivity to Beta behavioral patterns. This leads me to believe that after a certain threshold of tolerance women’s perception of that Beta is set for her.
After that threshold forced obligation to bolstering his confidence isn’t even an afterthought to a woman, thus compliments and admiration are an alien concept to her. So trying to convince women they ought to compliment more, respect more, admire more runs counter to what her hindbrain Hypergamy expects is her optimal due.
Thats why it’s so offensive – how dare GWADT tell her to behave counter to her Hypergamous imperative when she’s concluded a man is Beta? It’s like suggesting she throw her life away betting more on a horse that’s already lost the race.
April 9th, 2015 at 3:27 pm
““The beta can possibly become more alpha by being admired, respected, desired, felt addicted to, etc. but realistically, I don’t think many women do that for a beta husband/man.”
All the binary responses to this proposition. You can’t turn a Beta into an Alpha. BULLSHIT! Alpha-Beta is on a continuum it is not either or.
There is no doubt in my mind whatsoever that a determined woman can and will increase the Alpha of her man by showing him respect and fucking him silly.
My question is why is there such opposition to this proposition?
Why are women seemingly completely opposed to the notion of even providing a false sense of respect and admiration?
Why is it impossible for a woman to take one for the team and at least ACT with respect towards the husband she helped Beta?
Why do men think that getting respect and admiration from a woman would not change him for the better?
Why do prostitutes offer this exact service for money when wives could offer it for a better husband and a better life?
The idea that a woman cannot respect a man who learns how to be Alpha is practically a Rollo maxim but I think it is flawed. EVERY man learns how to be Alpha at some point. They had interactions with women. Lots of people assume they were a “Natural” and that is why those interactions with women went well. But isn’t it possible it was those early positive interactions that nurtured and even created the “Natural.”
On the nature/nurture debate, the male/female divide is a chasm but I suspect the Alpha/Beta divide in men is not such a hard gap to mind.
April 9th, 2015 at 3:31 pm
And masculinity grows out of its own, complementing the feminine but never supplicating dependence upon the feminine.
April 9th, 2015 at 3:34 pm
My question is why is there such opposition to this proposition?
Unfortunately for the “masterbeta” reality is the opposition.
April 9th, 2015 at 3:49 pm
I was not going to comment, but @bluepillprofessor if you think every man can be an Alpha then you are smoking the good stuff. You should meet my brother. Wife tells him when to brush his teeth. What clothes to wear. How fast to drive. They have not had sex in years. She is fat and repulsive good bless her heart ( so is he). But that coward brother of mine an Alpha? He let me get beat up by four dirty rednecks in a parking lot a few years ago. He ran after opening his dumb ass mouth. Alpha? I wish most of my family members were Alpha. Shit, I’m not even Alpha by far.
April 9th, 2015 at 3:52 pm
This whole thing can be kind of compared to bicycle racing. A guy who used to race with us never kept up at really intense hammer time. He always got dropped and complained about himself for it. He was apparently trying hard but could never stay with the pack. He was capable but wasn’t training consistently or eating well. He asked everyone questions, TALKED techniques, diet, training, etc. and regularly complained about his performance. One day he asked me, “Man! how can you guys go 30 mph, I just cant seem to do it?
The answer somehow popped into my head, “If you never go 30, you’ll never go 30″.
April 9th, 2015 at 3:58 pm
“I’m coming to the suspicion that women’s revulsion towards Beta male psychology, personality and behaviors is an evolved instinct.
“There is a female hindbrain, limbic sensitivity to Beta behavioral patterns. This leads me to believe that after a certain threshold of tolerance women’s perception of that Beta is set for her.”
Right. You know all this, from your interactions with the HUS commentariat, and the Sunshine Mary blog You remember the discussions in which it was asserted that women could be sexually aroused by beta traits. You remember the assertions that female attraction triggers are malleable and that with effort, a woman can actually change what sexually arouses her. You remember those failures, do you not? You can see it right now at HUS, where Susan and her current commenters are stating outright that many men are not attractive to any women and there is not a damn thing those men can do about it. They are doomed to sexual failure and grinding involuntary celibacy their entire lives. If those men want sex, their only options are renting prostitutes and wanking to porn.
And you remember at SSM’s the contentious discussions I engaged in, regarding how attraction cannot be “generated” from nothing; one cannot “create” attraction or sexual arousal from nothing. You do remember, don’t you, the arguments over whether there is some attraction there and it can be rekindled; but if attraction/arousal aren’t there in the beginning, then they will never be there?
Those principles are at work here. The problem is that these women have to be encouraged to have sex with their beta husbands, because they aren’t sexually attracted to those men. They don’t want to have sex with those men. If they did, they’d be doing it instead of talking about it.
Dragonfly is writing about this because of the single biggest problem in marriages today — most women are married to men who just don’t trip their triggers. Most women are married to men who they are not attracted to; or who are less attractive than the men those women used to have sex with before they got married.
April 9th, 2015 at 4:11 pm
Respect = I am the only one you fuck .
Admiration = you blow me dry all the time.
Adore=anal sex.
Appreciated=after I come, you’re OK with me falling asleep.
Forgiving =if I cheat on you.
Loyalty =you take me back after I cheated.
come on fellow men , TELL me YOURS.
I have yet to see ONE of you explain what he means by needing respect/admiration/appreciation from a woman ?
I know ,,if you struggle with your answers ,, it means they mean nothing to you or to any woman .
women themselves struggle finding answers because they know the answers are the above.
“thus compliments and admiration are an alien concept to her”
Rollo Tomassi.
April 9th, 2015 at 4:17 pm
@dumbwhtboy
“I was not going to comment, but @bluepillprofessor if you think every man can be an Alpha then you are smoking the good stuff….”
I hope you are wrong. Hopefully every man is born alpha and that the beta we experience and see is the result of conditioning. Maybe alpha can be realized by men everywhere through developing themselves for the betterment of themselves and those around them rather than missing the opportunity by erroneously assuming alpha is a hoop to jump through to “get laid” or wishing alpha can some how be instilled by mothering.
April 9th, 2015 at 4:17 pm
And to further Deti’s take, we have this bit of reality –
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/04/08/elizabeth-plank-beyonce-flip-the-script_n_7026128.html
April 9th, 2015 at 4:18 pm
See above T
April 9th, 2015 at 4:21 pm
NBTM – nope, most people are born to follow, just a few to lead. Some followers can become good commanders and fulfill their leaders wish, but most just stay a part of the herd.
April 9th, 2015 at 4:21 pm
Betas can become Alpha, Alphas can become Betas. Personality is malleable and Alpha is a mindset.
However, expecting that a woman can (or will even try to) do it for a man she’s in an LTR with is like expecting that if you just ignore gravity hard enough you can fly without a plane. Expecting that a woman can get a guy you can “work on” and make him Alpha is as stupid as a guy getting a slightly overweight chick and thinking he can make her lose that weight and be hot. That ain’t how it works.
It must come from his own internal motivations and decisions or it simply isn’t an Alpha mindset he’s fostering. Much like an alcoholic cannot overcome their addictions until they decide they want to, a Beta cannot give up being a Beta until he decides with everything in him that he wants to. Nobody can do it for him.
April 9th, 2015 at 4:23 pm
I wonder if Beta behavior can ever be reclassified as pathological the way Alpha behavior is these days. It sure as hell should be, with the awful consequences it sets a man up for.