When I first got laid in 1985, I went to the bathroom, toweled off the equipment and walked down to 7-11 for a big gulp. No blue birds landed on my shoulder to whistle Disney songs and no ray of sunlight broke through the clouds to shine on me. Nor did I think “damn, that was terrible, I’ve lost all respect for myself, I’ll never be the same again,…sob!”, it felt pretty good. The traffic lights still worked, the busses ran on time (sorta) and food still tasted good.
I’ve had sex with over 40 women since then. I got laid first when I was 17 and on average I’ve been having sex with my wife 2-3 times a week (and a hummer on her off weeks) for coming up on 17 years now. Sex is a great part of life, sometimes it’s memorable, sometimes it’s taking care of myself, but it’s never been some epic experience of cosmic importance. It keeps you healthy in body, mind and spirit, and the best I can describe sex is that it’s an important part of a balanced life experience. People have been fucking a lot longer than anyone’s had time to contemplate the esoteric significance of sex.
I can remember listening to an episode of the Tom Leykis show when he was on terrestrial radio, and he described what sex is like for men. He said, sex is like taking a piss for a guy – sooner or later he’s got to take care of himself and let loose. Now, most guys would prefer to take a piss in a nice clean bathroom, where the towels smell good and he can feel comfortable and unhurried. Sure, he’d love to have the occasion to take a piss in the bathroom of a four star hotel with gold plated faucets and all the trimmings, but when he really has to go, he’ll stop along the side of the road or take a piss at a dirty gas station urinal. Sooner or later he’s gonna have to go.
What prompted today’s post was my reading a recent blog entry of a notable christo-manosphere commenter. I’m not going to name him since I think most of the readers who frequent Rational Male from Dalrock or Sunshinemary’s blogs already know who I’m referencing. What’s important is his life’s plight. The nuts and bolts of his post was his lament in finding a suitable, monogamous mate to marry, have sex with and (presumedly) have a life and children with.
It’s not too tall an order for even the most abject Beta of men. To be sure, nowadays it increasingly requires a good amount of self-delusion and / or faith for a guy to consider monogamy, and red pill disillusionment can help or aggravate, but statistically more people are engaging in monogamy than not at some stage of their lives. However, this blogger feels doomed and relegated to what I can only assume is a self-inflicted life of celibacy due to his religious convictions and his inability to connect with the properly prescribed virgin bride who fits his ideal.
Now before I dive too far in here, I’m not going to debate the merits or limitations of this guy’s conviction. Before I started considering this post I realized I’ll be run up the moralist flagpole for even using his predicament as my example, but what I’m going to focus on is the need men (and by association women) have for sex. Try to keep this in mind.
Big Heads and Little Heads
One very common dismissal of red pill awareness I read from blue pill men is this feigned, blasé indifference to sex.
“All that Red Pill, PUA shit is for guy’s who obsess over sex. They only go to the lengths they do to get laid and never see the bigger picture. You don’t need sex you know, you wont die from not getting laid.”
For the most part this pseudo-indifference is really a feminized, conditioned, response couched in Beta Game. The idea, of course, is for the blue pill guy to promote the public perception that he’s above his sexual impulses in the hopes that any girl within earshot (or reading his comments online) will recognize his uniqueness in not letting his cock do his thinking for him. From a male deductive logic standpoint it makes sense to the feminized male – women have all told him how put off they are with guys who only think about sex, so he’ll identify with the women he’d like to get with and “not be like other guys.”
Boys subscribing to this identification usually find themselves sexually frustrated by the very women they hope to connect with in their sexual indifference because, on a core level, women are psychologically insulted by men who actively desexualize themselves in order to get with them. Despite every verbal protestation women can muster, women are aroused by, and ego-affirmed by, Men who unashamedly display the covert social cues of wanting to fuck them.
Thats the Beta Game behind the “you don’t need sex” Buffer, but there’s more too this rationale than that. Technically the Beta reasoning is correct; physically, you’re not going to die if you don’t get laid. You could probably masturbate to relieve yourself or live a sexless existence due to a physical disability and live a productive life as satisfying as you can manage it. If you don’t know what you’re missing or if a sexual substitute does the job, what’s the difference, right? The line of reasoning is that if it isn’t food, water or oxygen it isn’t really a necessity for existence.
From an absolutist perspective it’s one of those conveniently unassailable positions that excuse a guy’s inability to get laid – “no one really needs sex, and if you think you do you’re obviously preoccupied with it and letting your little head do the thinking for you.” By this line of reasoning, basic necessities like clothing and shelter could be considered superfluous needs for living, but since it’s sex, and in most respects hedonistically enjoyable, special consideration has to be given.
The unhealthy disconnect here is that human beings do in fact need sex. We can attach other ephemeral aspects to the sex act (or masturbation if that’s the only recourse), like love, emotion, commitment, etc., but on a base level your body needs sexual release in one form or another. Yes, you can willfully override the need, just like you can overcome hunger while you’re fasting or on a hunger strike, but the need is still the operative in that act of will. Once hunger, breathing and thirst are satisfied, sex is the single most influential drive the human species (really, most any species) is motivated by. Society is driven by sex, cultures evolve around it and personal achievements, as well as horrible atrocities are the result of our inborn prompt to satisfy our sexual urges.
Sigmund Freud once said, “all energy is sexual”, meaning that subliminally we will redirect our motivation for ungratified sexual impulse to other endeavors. Thus it’s men, being the sex with the highest amount of libido inducing testosterone, who must look for far more outlets to transfer this motivation to than women. So is it any real surprise that it’s historically been Men who’ve primarily been the empire builders, the conquerors, the creators, and destroyers who’ve (for better or worse) moved humanity the most significantly?
Life Experience
If I said I felt pity for men like the blogger I mentioned earlier, who through their own conviction or bad circumstance, have never had sex in their lives, I don’t think I’d be accurate in expressing myself. I feel a profound sadness for them; a sadness similar to when you meet someone who’s lost a limb or has had to live with a physical or mental disability. For guys who want to tell you that you don’t need sex to live a fulfilling life I’m sure this sounds like conceit. There are plenty of inspirational individuals who live their lives without arms or legs, or with other disabilities, that we can all look up to for “overcoming the odds”, but the reason they are inspiring is because they must strive for a quality of life that others simply take for granted. Run a marathon and it’s quite an achievement, but do it as a paraplegic and it’s a triumph of human will.
Sometimes a sexless life is a choice of conviction, but more often it’s not a choice for men, it’s simply their circumstance. I grieve every time I read a comment by, or receive a painful request for help from a late 30’s man who’s still a virgin. Sex is a part of a healthy human experience; if you want to apply meaning to it, if you only consider its legitimacy within marriage or monogamy, or if you enjoy sex with many women, the function is still the same.
I felt this way after I read the aforementioned blogger relating his frustration about his not being able to find an appropriate woman to wife under today’s social climate. This post isn’t an attempt to convince him to adjust his expectations; I can’t necessarily empathize with his convictions or his reasonings (I’ve always enjoyed sex, and never felt guilt for enjoying it), however, I can empathize with his deep desire to become intimate and sexual with a woman. This healthy human experience is denied to him by conviction, but it doesn’t alleviate his desire for it.
He needs sex.
June 30th, 2013 at 2:11 pm
Is sex a ‘need’? And if so, what is the need: sex with another person or sexual expression generally that might, or might not, include masturbation?
Is a ‘drive’ the same as a ‘need’? Are ‘horrible atrocities’ just the consequence of a ‘need’? Are sexual urges associated with such atrocities analogous to needs? If so, where do we draw the line if we say sex is a necessity? Does it mean we accept ‘horrible atrocities’ because they are committed out of necessity?
Sex can be fun, a form of stress release, bring people closer, create connection, trust, hope, security, invigorate people, leave them radiant, happy, satisfied. Why would anyone advocate a sexless life? Why not experiment with sex, enjoy our bodies and have as much sex as we want? Why not let go of sexual guilt and shame. Sex can be a healthy human experience and why shouldn’t people have as much sex as they want?
But desire isn’t always need is it? They are 2 different concepts. It is still possible to be pro-sex and sex-positive without claiming sex with another person is a ‘necessity of life’ for fulfillment.
I’m not surprised that if a man places such restrictions on the circumstances that sex is permissible for him, he is going to start feeling the desire so strongly it feels like a necessity. The way I see it, the man Tomassi is referring to has built a cage around himself only to start rattling the bars and complaining. I had a client in a similar situation. He had decided he had a ‘sex addiction’ and, because of his use of pornography, his wife was denying him sex. So he then decided, to cure himself, he would not allow himself to masturbate. I think the appropriate expression is “cutting off the nose to spite the face”. He was just digging himself a deeper hole because he was dealing with his desire by limiting its expression. And so he felt sex was a ‘need’ that he had no control over. Thereby confirming to himself that he was a sex-addict. A self-fulfilling prophecy!
If you scroll through the comments, 90% of them are referring to Christianity and religion and the way in which it has conditioned the poster’s own or others sexuality. So what if someone thinks sex is a need or not? What difference does it actually make?
I wonder whether this question might be masking a more relevant one:
How has your conditioning affected the way you relate to women and men and the way you relate to your own body?
How might you re-condition yourself to enjoy more pleasure from your body and better relationships with women?
June 30th, 2013 at 5:10 pm
Sex is overrated and addictive.
Having sex = immense amount of dopamine release, you are reprogramming the brain to crave that feelings once again. The brain isn’t designed to constantly have sex.
I have nothing against having sex, but I’ll let the girls come to me when the oppertunity arises. I won’t go out of my way to try to pull a chick home.
Why should I waste my time chasing after sex when I can study and become a doctor, then acquire said sex? Acquiring a doctors degree by the time I’m 25, specializing in cardiology and subsequently pulling in hundreds of thousands $ a year.
^
Does that sound better than flipping burgers and spending the weekends drinking for the rest of your life?
Rollo, you sound butthurt for having a worthless degree @ university and having the jack of one trade (being a >40 year old who tries to specialize on the opposite gender). I pity guys who’s life only circulates around sex.
June 30th, 2013 at 5:30 pm
Permanent Guest … not necessarily.
“men who will say “I need sex!” are the first to deny that they need a woman. You can’t have one without the other. “
For instance, in my country, there are few eligible women … and millions of sheep …
June 30th, 2013 at 7:25 pm
[…] intend to respond to Rollo’s post on how Men Need Sex, which he wrote in response to my All Alone in the Dark […]
July 1st, 2013 at 12:34 pm
No, it’s evolved to constantly assess sexual availability (men) and parental investment potential (women).
You might be better served reading this:
http://therationalmale.com/2011/11/17/the-pheromonal-beta/
But since we’re playing “Beat that Absolutism”, consider this:
Sex is a need, because without it, without the constant pursuit of diversifying the genetic pool, the human species dies out. Ergo, sex is a human need.
July 1st, 2013 at 1:40 pm
I was struck by me’s comment. Four years chaste and he feels dead inside. I can beat that by a factor of two. I’m betting we’re not that far apart in age either. I don’t feel dead inside, but I sure as hell have a lot of scar tissue. I had a distant and uninvolved father who was a midnight drinker, a co-dependent mother, and a whole trainload of unmet needs when entering calendar adulthood. Except nobody talked about “unmet needs” back then. It was called “I don’t know what’s wrong with you (me)”.
Cutting a long story short, after a while in recovery I realised that I had sex for the same reason I drank: it made me feel as if I was Living A Life. Look! I must be living, I got laid! I got drunk! I got a job! I got a pay rise! I got a flat of my own! I got a mortgage! I got a girlfriend! I lost a girlfriend! I went on holiday! I must be living. Right? Wrong. Based on my experience, living isn’t about what you do, it’s about how you feel when you’re doing it, and mostly I felt absent. Absent was how I coped then.
I have no idea what regular people do sex for. I’m an addict / alcoholic / ACoA and I’m wired differently. (If you don’t understand that, or think it’s a crock, be grateful, be very, very grateful.) I know I need to heft The Iron and eat right or I will turn into one of those many pieces of physical sludge that get on my commuter train. I know I need to read challenging non-fiction, because otherwise my brain will turn into the kind of jelly that is satisfied with game shows. That I get. But for a long while, once I didn’t need the fake feeling of “living a life”, I had no idea what the point of sex was. Because as a physical pleasure, I get more of a high from a good dance anthem. Or a good steak. Or from sunshine (I live in England – the sun rarely shines over here, so it’s wonderful when it does).
I don’t feel dead inside. I don’t even feel numb. The only reason I’d like to get laid again is to prove that, at my age, I Still Got It. Ego. Vanity. (Fine motives both – very few non-vain, non-sporty people are in any kind of decent physical shape.) That’s good enough for entertaining someone who’s out for some sport, but it’s not something I’d like to do to, you know, an actual acquaintance.
Good. Glad I’ve sorted that out.
July 2nd, 2013 at 1:46 pm
Not related to this specific article, but to the broader theme of the blog. Here’s an example of the feminine imperative even in video games: grown up males must be presented as equals to teenage girls…
http://tinyurl.com/l3kj4o5
July 3rd, 2013 at 1:01 am
[…] need sex. An interesting […]
July 3rd, 2013 at 4:50 am
“Run a marathon and it’s quite an achievement, but do it as a paraplegic and it’s a triumph of human will.”
Agreed.
I do not feel pity for sexeless man, on condition that it his own choosing. However, I honestly feel pity for every sex obsessed or married man, be it his own volition or not. This guy is able to make himself believe that his senseless slavery to his woman and children is goood, moreover has some, ehm, higher purpose. He is entirely happy in his role as a slave and has arrived at a goal he had soooo long desired. Due to this thing he persuades himself that every man NEED this. He is definitely not able to understand freedom.
Do not fool ourselves, it is not about SEX. It is just the macho stupidity – I am the MAN I NEED sex. Nope. It is about the deep need of a man – slave, to be VALIDATED and recognized by woman, to HAVE woman in his life. If we need just sex as a free men, we would be perfectly happy with hookers.
Due to this one I hold every free man, celibate or not – from his own volition, waaay above every WOMEN (not sex) obsessed or married slave. THIS is the triumph of manly will.
July 3rd, 2013 at 5:46 am
@ seven dials
“I don’t feel dead inside. I don’t even feel numb. The only reason I’d like to get laid again is to prove that, at my age, I Still Got It. Ego. Vanity.”
This one. It is no different than having a new sports car, running our own company, etc. We have this innate feeling that we have to PROVE something, we have to achieve something, to be MEN. And we are dancing for our masters – women, to be choosen by them. Without this – without women, cars, children, job, work….we are NOTHING. This is the problem, and the deep reason for the expression – “you NEED SEX”. Young men are pursuing those things – you know, you HAVE to fuck 20 beauties, to be the MAN, you HAVE to run your business and be the BOSS, to be the man, you have to do this, you have to do that. You have to PERFORM, to be worthy. Otherwise you are looser, you are trash, you are nothing. But even after you achieve ALL this, there is still this sense of emptiness inside, so we have to stick to our possesions and masters – women, cos without them..we are again….nothing. If we need sex, whats the fucking point in sexing the same unattractive beast for 20 years? Is THIS “sex” at all?
This is manifested in feelings of countless divorced guys..suddently they lost their masters – women, their property, their children. They were robbed of all they ever had, they were robbed of their own identity, their sense of self. And this is the reason of continuos obsession about women, about their feelings, about how they operate, etc… many guys are able to popp out thousands articles about women… as if women were important. Women are NOT important, it is about US. Women are only mirroring ourselves, this is all they ever were. Red pill is not about “how to behave to be better slave, to be alpha, to have maaany women”. Red pill is about understanding ourselves and breaking those chains.
July 3rd, 2013 at 7:10 am
@ seven dials
It’s imperative to understand that both narcissism and borderline personality disordered people have incurred similar types of wounds in childhood from a dysfunctional family dynamic (i.e. alcoholic parent, BPD mother etc.) it’s only a natural selection process that we are drawn to people spinning on a similar axis ( similar stunted emotional growth be they, emotional abusers, controllers manipulators etc.) the reason the your relationships don’t work out is that neither person can resolve conflict in an adult manner and the standard default response is the single loop learned map from childhood. Have you been to therapy?
The reason I ask is I grew up with a bpd mother I know exactly how you feel.
July 3rd, 2013 at 9:28 am
@Gregg
“This is manifested in feelings of countless divorced guys..suddently they lost their masters – women, their property, their children. They were robbed of all they ever had, they were robbed of their own identity, their sense of self.”
I don’t know if I buy the rest, but I do know this feeling – this sense of loss, or better yet, the sense of being “lost”. But I also read it thinking…if you’ve “lost” everything and there is nothing else to lose, why doesn’t that feel like freedom? Anger, rage against the whole thing? I know I’ve felt anger and rage – disappointment – disillusionment – depressed – confused and generally out of sorts.
But if it is true that WE have a choice – that we can think what we want, we can feel what we want, we can do what we want – especially now that we have lost everything – then why don’t we? Thanks for posting that, it really is something to think about
July 3rd, 2013 at 2:32 pm
@ yep its me
“I don’t know if I buy the rest, but I do know this feeling – this sense of loss, or better yet, the sense of being “lost”. But I also read it thinking…if you’ve “lost” everything and there is nothing else to lose, why doesn’t that feel like freedom? Anger, rage against the whole thing? I know I’ve felt anger and rage – disappointment – disillusionment – depressed – confused and generally out of sorts.”
We DO have choice, do not worry. Unfortunatelly, if this feeling is your default condition, read the cynical optimist here – you might have been the child of BPD/NPD parents. I had some clients with BPD/NPD past and diagnosis…BPD parents are not emotionally available and children are severly handicaped as a result. My utmost respect goes to children of such people, they are the right warriors disadvantaged much more than people without legs or arms. IN such a case, seek serious help, my friend. This is not a blog for you. Best wishes.
July 3rd, 2013 at 2:46 pm
@ yep
sorry, bro, I have not noticed that you are other person than “seven dials”. Everything is all right.
July 3rd, 2013 at 6:34 pm
@gregg…No prob. And actually I don’t disagree with what you wrote – it’s just that the part i copied really hit me.
July 3rd, 2013 at 6:39 pm
@gregg
It’s hard sometimes to make sense of comments (because we sometimes use them more like forums – but we have what we have right) … I copied a portion of your comment, because as a Man well down the divorce path in my own life, what you wrote struck me – from a perspective of “what can’t this thing be a freeing thing, rather than a sucky thing?”.
So, it was just something I that I want to ponder and wanted to thank you for your insight.
July 4th, 2013 at 9:57 am
This article was a bloody dose.
July 4th, 2013 at 11:34 am
@ gregg
Thanks. Get your point about being driven to achieve because we are men. Quite so and the way it should be, though achievement recognition. I don’t feel empty when I achieve by my lights, but sure I’ve felt empty when other people recognise something I don’t think is a big deal.
When I said “Ego. Vanity” it was like a Good Thing. I think any motive that gets you into shape and achieving is a goodie – because being a dumb tub of lard when you could be otherwise is an absolute abuse of yourself.
It was actually a relief when I realised that was my motive – because I thought I was trying to get into a “relationship” – and why would I do that when it worked out so well in the past (irony alert). Actually I just wanted to get laid to prove I could. Sigh of relief.
@cynical optimist
Thanks. I get the thing about fnerk-ups being drawn to other fnerk-ups. Happens all the time to me even now. The very fact I’m mysteriously attracted to a girl means she should probably go to therapy.
I’m probably mis-reading your syntax, but I’m not borderline or narcissist. According to the conditions in DSM-IV, those are near-psychiatric disorders and I’m just an ex-drunk. Therapy? I have twenty years sober and done / working the 12 Steps. It’s a process with different aims from therapy. I’m happier with it, but it’s for people with a specific problem. Not for people with the damage you’re talking about. (I know DSM-V is out, but I haven’t read it yet.)
July 4th, 2013 at 11:35 am
Sorry, that should be “achievement is not the same as recognition”. The thing ate my angle-brackets.
July 5th, 2013 at 1:51 am
Not getting this post at all. If its specifically addressing some basement blogger that won’t bang any chicks because they aren’t “good enough” morally like Mother Teresa or have T&A like some starlet fine.
But if this is really to men in general that sex is a “need”…..WTF???
Let me add to the list – Cold beer, Filet Mignon, Non-Well Vodka….
As someone who has actual real life needs met & 2 chics in rotation – Sex ain’t a need. If I’m broke I’ll set the sex to the side just as I would the cable tv subscription till I get real life needs back flowing.
Really surprised to see this – think this article may be the work of a hacker.
Peace.
July 5th, 2013 at 3:21 am
[…] […]
July 5th, 2013 at 3:28 pm
So many great comments, I can’t read them all. But I want to link to an article by the theologian Peter Kreeft about sex in heaven.
http://www.peterkreeft.com/topics/sex-in-heaven.htm
He talks about a lot things, but his main point is that sex is what you are, not something you do, and therefore an intrinsic piece of you that cannot be denied, even after death and resurrection.
July 6th, 2013 at 9:18 am
The idea, of course, is for the blue pill guy to promote the public perception that he’s above his sexual impulses in the hopes that any girl within earshot (or reading his comments online) will recognize his uniqueness in not letting his cock do his thinking for him
This is pursuit of *the lift*, the term Steve Dahl coined on Chicago radio in the 80’s and I have adapted to a cyber version. If the blogger is who I suspect it is, I do not see him chasing the lift, but when men do chase it they get, simply, positive female response…the cyber lift. This, as a form of sexual pursuit or Beta Game actually worked in high school in the 70’s, too well in hind sight. It nearly never failed then, 100% lift rate for me. (Or in Ron Burgundy stats, 80% 0f the time it works every time) It’s embarrassing to recall how naive I was and how much more naive the girls were to offer up the very thing i was trying to give vibes that I didn’t care if I got.
If someone states unequivocally they do not need sex, they are playing with words.
July 7th, 2013 at 6:54 am
Big themes like noble sacrifice get kicked around on the internet. Words are cheap and I doubt anyone preaching shit like that have really done anything like a noble sacrifice.
Deeds not words, but we live in the age of words not deeds.
The only reason a man needs a woman is sex. They have nothing real, substantial or enduring to offer beyond sex.
July 17th, 2013 at 3:13 pm
I want to strangle you with my own bare hands
[You’ll have to kiss me first.]
July 17th, 2013 at 9:21 pm
[…] post is intended in part as a response to Rollo Tomassi’s post You Need Sex over at The Rational Male. However, it goes beyond the bounds of Rollo’s post and covers the […]
July 19th, 2013 at 5:42 pm
Sex every three days or oftener with the same woman – bonded. Any less – looking.
July 19th, 2013 at 5:52 pm
empathologism
July 6th, 2013 at 9:18 am
A variation of that game that gets you laid 75% of the time.
“Snuggle naked with me. No sex. I love the body contact.” True to my word I didn’t have sex with the, About 75% came back gagging for it. The other 25%? I got to snuggle naked with them.
If you keep at the girls most will give in to the naked snuggle if you work your game right.
August 19th, 2013 at 2:25 am
“you wont die from not getting laid.”
Unless you commit suicide. I seriously considered it during my (almost entirely sexless) college years, but once I started getting laid, the “suicidal ideation” never got very far.
August 22nd, 2013 at 1:27 am
[…] there’s an assumption among many that those who don’t, can’t. There’s reason to think this way; unappealing […]
October 15th, 2013 at 10:53 am
[…] so pay attention. It cannot have been a simple desire to empty his balls that drove this man, as Tom Leykis has described, because he did not have […]
October 9th, 2014 at 1:39 am
[…] of Nevada). Honestly, I hold no disapproval for men who feel this is the best way to satisfy their need for sex and female contact. It may indeed be your best option under the current social […]
November 18th, 2014 at 3:59 am
@ PermanentGuest:
But as you may become sad over a man who says he has never had sex, I lament the man that has let his mind, body, and (dare I say) soul become controlled by a desire for sex, living life just looking for the next relief.
That is like saying we are controlled by the desire for food or the desire for leisure or the desire for heat. We crave these things when we don’t have them, but once we have enough of them we think about other things. So it is with sex. If there is a craving, it is because there isn’t enough of it. To feel this craving isn’t wrong, and it doesn’t mean a person wants sex around the clock.
March 2nd, 2015 at 8:38 pm
[…] ~Rollo Tomassi, from his essay You Need Sex […]
March 16th, 2015 at 6:17 pm
[…] ~Rollo Tomassi, from his essay You Need Sex […]
March 28th, 2015 at 12:41 am
[…] ~Rollo Tomassi, from his essay You Need Sex […]