http://live.huffingtonpost.com/r/segment/why-do-girls-date/5154ae1878c90a511200016b
As glad as I am to see George from 3rd Millenium Man grab the manopshere colors and go to the front lines, I’ll admit I’m a little disappointed with this. Roosh has predicted 2013 will be the year the manosphere goes mainstream, but my concern is less about the exposure and more about the representation. The MSM is the feminine imperative.
I understand the host here is contracted to the Huff-Po so the context begins in terms of what entertains women’s need for indignation. No indignation, no audience. George is hamstrung from the outset: we have the ubiquitous 50+, “I’m ok with the beta provider I married after fucking my spell of bad boys and learned my lesson so you gals should learn from my mistakes” woman (aka the Aunt Giggles, Kay Hymowitz archetype). Next we have the prerequisite “clinical psychologist” who looks like one of the mothers on Dance Moms, and rattles off the feel good humanist psychology truisms clichéd in the 1990’s. After that we have Nathan the self-identified White Knight who’s only purpose is to bolster both women’s feeble positions to better identify with any woman in the hopes that she might be watching and, God willing, anonymously seek him out to potentially hook up with him for being such a team player.
That’s a tough cast to work with so I will commend George on his effort, however, his dropping the ball here is less about his grasp of red-pill wisdom (I know and read his blog regularly), and more about the context that the MSM will allow the manosphere to be represented in. Learn this now red-pill literati before you venture into the MSM – the feminine imperative will gladly make you the red meat for the indignation that sells their advertising to women.
As I said, Roosh predicts that the manosphere will surface in the MSM this year, and I will concur, the manosphere will come to the attention of the greater whole of western society, but don’t think for minute it will be for the positive. With any luck it will reach out to a few blue pill men ready to realize the truth, but my trepidation is about the overall image the manosphere will be molded to by the Feminine Imperative. Men are simply not allowed to have any legitimate insight into intergender dynamics – as I’m sure George is realizing now. In girl-world, women are the sole arbiters of relationship wisdoms – men are simply foils for their legitimacy, even in the best of pretenses.
I don’t write too much specifically about the manosphere with good reason – the ‘enlightenment’ is still evolving. As I’ve been quoted many times before, unplugging guys from the Matrix is dirty work. It’s triage, and the greater majority of men aren’t ready or even in a mental position to be unplugged when you’re in a personal, one-on-one context. So when you extrapolate that to a larger context it’s easy to see how the feminine imperative will readily use men’s default lack of legitimacy for its own purpose. The greatest Threat to the Feminine Imperative is men becoming self-aware of their own sexual market value and the dissemination of information about how the imperative uses this lack of awareness to perpetuate itself.
The first recourse to prevent this is male-specific ridicule and derision for even attempting to explain the social constructs of the feminine imperative.
In a large public forum like this Huff-Po video we don’t see the underlying feminine social urgency and anxiety about men becoming aware of the mechanisms of the feminine imperative because for decades women’s unknowability has become synonymous with the feminine mystique. So it’s made laughable by default that any man would have a legitimate understanding of women – they are just unknowable, so men’s perspectives and insight about the psychology of women starts from a position of ridicule, even when it patronizingly agrees with women’s perspectives.
But underneath the Dance Mom psychological snark, underneath the accusatory tones 50+ woman uses to burn interview time, underneath the attempts at hopeful beta white knight feminine identification, even in the overall context the host uses to broach the topic, red pill men can see the nervous tension of the possibility of the rational exposure of the underpinnings of the feminine imperative.
When you’re in an isolated social setting, it’s a dangerous topic to venture into – like religion or politics – but you can make an effort without too much social repercussion. You can speak red pill truth and endure the wrath of women (who’ll likely fuck you after the fact) and white knights, but you’ll make a point. You may even open the eyes of a few men. However, the larger, meta-scale feminine narrative will use and distort your red pill awareness to make advertisers rich.
Women sustain themselves on indignation and nothing stimulates that better than a man who publicly declares he knows how women think. The Atlantic has made a very profitable business model for a dying form of media based solely upon this feminine-satisfying indignation. This host, the Huff-Po, are simply following the model. So yes, Roosh is right, the manosphere will go mainstream this year, to the overwhelming adulation of the media that’s discovered this type of feminine imperative indignation is extremely profitable.
April 5th, 2013 at 9:09 am
The Manosphere will go mainstream and will be recognized for the sophistry and poor analyzing skills of its bloggers.
Rollo’s analysis is stunted by his poor reading of biology and psychology, and a narrow understanding of human nature. He sounds like a French philosopher drawing arcane abstractions from very superficial observations. Foucalt would have admired him.
Rollo is not the inquisitive type who is driven with a passion to know. He is only obsessed with knowing the ways of women, but he doesn’t know how. I don’t think he ever reads books, which is reflected in the conversational style of his writing.
The problem is that he will think, but he will not learn. First comes the concrete and anecdotal, with which you build abstract theories. Not vice versa, otherwise see Women’s Studies 101.
I recommend reading a few novels from Fyodor Dostoyevsky, Charles Dickens or Mark Twain. Rollo might come to understand human nature better.
April 5th, 2013 at 9:14 am
Socialkenny is suspiciously eager to shame people into outing themselves. The only other topic he discusses is how he gets blogs shut down. If he’s a plant, his bosses really ought to dock his pay.
April 5th, 2013 at 9:18 am
Well it appears that Aunt Giggles the coward has bit off more than she could chew with the manosphere (even an orgy of attention has its limits) and has gone back to purging and censoring her comments again. My guess is she’ll delete the whole post by the end of the day so as not to sully the impression her blog advertisers have of her.
There’s something to be said about the validity of your message when you’re beholden to advertising interests.
Really Suz, your histrionics even surprised me this time.
@SSM, hopefully you’re reading my comments here, but what got deleted on Giggles site is that I officially redact any comparison I ever made between you and her. I know Aunt Giggles and you are no Aunt Giggles.
@Kate, I’m really not as faceless as you might think:
https://rationalmale.wordpress.com/2011/09/09/well-do-it-live/
April 5th, 2013 at 9:24 am
Very funny Matt.
April 5th, 2013 at 9:32 am
Almost every YaReally post ever.
http://yareally-archive.s3.amazonaws.com/201211.html
April 5th, 2013 at 9:33 am
The more I observe Susan, the more I despise her. She runs her site like Nurse Ratchet.
April 5th, 2013 at 10:03 am
@ Rollo
Thank you.
Oddly, I had been considering commenting here that I finally concede some of your points about the feminine imperative. Previously, I didn’t agree and wasn’t seeing it, but I see it now oh-so-clearly in what Mrs. Walsh writes.
She wrote that she “understands game very well.” I find that odd because while I don’t understand game very well, I understand it well enough to know that wide-spread knowledge of it will not quickly lead to the production of sexy husband-bots that Mrs. Walsh seems to think it will.
I don’t know if she is just playing with fire that she doesn’t fully understand or if she’s trying to create an illusion on purpose.
April 5th, 2013 at 10:17 am
Rollo,
I assume you appear as yourself on that video. I can’t watch it at work and I’ve been cut off at home from the internet/social media till I get my computer a new battery. Anyway, very cool. I think you fall into the category of someone who is their screename completely. There would be no reason to use your legal name. You ARE Rollo Tomassi. That is what you have built your reputation on. Look, when I agreed to put my real name in Savoy’s book, I was a little concerned. But, I was proud to be a part of it and I wasn’t going to use my silly screename in a book by a major publisher even though that community knew me as QueenBee. I showed the book to a few people in my real life and the topic is just so far off their radar, they were just like, oh, that’s nice Katherine. lol They have NO idea.
April 5th, 2013 at 10:18 am
“@Itsme- Dude, y’all are really taking this shit too seriously. I mean, what am I missing here? I’ve yet to hear a single case of any Manosphere, Game, seduction or PUA blogger getting framed or fucked due to his photos being searched online. The doom and gloom theories y’all guys revert to is just hilarious. And this is why the Manosphere is a joke as it is today: too many paranoid guys. Life is fucking short! Live it up! Live on the edge! Take fucking risks! Life in itself is a risk and gamble since we all can get our brains blown out by some random psycho tomorrow. So let it all hang the fuck out! That should be the Manosphere’s policy. Not a bunch of chodes whining and crying over Google searches and their professions being jeopardize. That is a Beta-Male’s mentality and approach. The reason I’m a very successful PUA (coach) is that I’m balls to the walls when it comes to women. Any guy who’s successful with women (be it Krauser, Roosh, etc.) All live by this motto.
Roosh has already predicted the Manosphere’s fall and the MRA’s fall, but no one seems to be raising that issue which Roosh blogged about not too long ago.”
What the fuck do you know about politics? Anonymity has been used throughout History because specific politic opinions can lead to complete destruction of one’s life. You have no life, you have no ambition, fair enough. But some people do have a life, do have things they cherish, they care about, the want to protect and develop. Only an idiot would advocate to fight a giant upfront.
You are either the most naïve guy I’ve ever seen, or you have your own agenda. And you don’t seem THAT naïve, man.
April 5th, 2013 at 10:24 am
@Bob- So they should stop fucking blogging! It’s as simple as that! If it’s too much on the line; then stick to playing video games! Y’all dudes are fucking whiners in this Manosphere BS, and it’s readily apparent to me why no of you guys get laid nor have a life. I’d written about this before: 99% of the Manosphere is saturated by guys who have no fucking life besides work to home; which means no fucking life. Being a android/robot is not a life! 99 % of the Manosphere writers are couch-potatoes who don’t have a social life, never go out, have no women in their lives which is why they created this feminism bogeyman, etc. GTFOH with that crap!
April 5th, 2013 at 10:32 am
Off thread to Rollo. I had a facebook message from kid who read comments of mine on PBS and he wrote me. I pointed him to you. Here is a follow up I got today.
“I’m 21 after reading rational male I can say I took the red pill. It fits into my worldview of biology (men and women ARE DIFFERENT! !!) I just never had these trends related to me by any men, I was raised by 4 women and my father who works 60 hour weeks to this day, never explaining much of anything. The part I enjoy is how its common sense and logic… not abstract ideals usually, which is how women have clouded my understanding when raising me. I still haven’t checked out returnofkings yet… I have a bit of reading to do if I’m actually going to take advantage of the knowledge and test it out for myself”
+1 converted. One more saved. One less casualty. Good work.
April 5th, 2013 at 10:58 am
@Rollo
“My guess is she’ll delete the whole post by the end of the day so as not to sully the impression her blog advertisers have of her.”
Yep, probably. That one really backfired on her lol not only did we all stomp all over her silly shaming/goading tactics, but even her own audience chimed in against her article, and on top of it she just slammed 3MM who conducted himself with calm and reserve. She must spend all day in a perpetual hamster spin. I could write such a psychological breakdown of Sue and the repetitive tactics she uses, but god what a waste of time that would be.
@Lumpy
Holy SHIT, that is BEAUTIFUL. How does that exist?? Did you make it? Is it automatically generated somehow? That’s exactly what I wanted to do as a blog, just archive all my posts and the threads they’re from, but in a nice clean readable format. Is it cool if I link to it from a WordPress blog? Happy to credit you for it! Awesome stuff.
@SocialKenny
You are still retarded.
@Mark Minter
Good stuff, brings a smile to my heart lol. I remember the biggest thing that hooked me on PUA/red-pill was how it made everything click. All the experiences in my life that didn’t make sense listening to blue pill conditioning were just like puzzle pieces snapping together with each article/post I read on each topic. This is why I say all we have to do is get men to look at these resources…the information will carry things from there. We don’t need to brow-beat an entire audience over the head with info for an hour…their conversion to the red pill will happen late at night when their wife has gone to sleep (after not fucking them) and they’re up secretly lurking through these sites absorbing the information.
April 5th, 2013 at 10:59 am
@socialkenny
you asked how someone’s pic could possibly be used to harm him. i gave an answer.
did you start off the day with too much refined sugar?
April 5th, 2013 at 11:09 am
The manosphere would do well to study groups like the Nation of Islam who also had to develop a “code” for dealing with mainstream media who pretended to want to interview them, but really want to discredit them. One technique they learned (and this also goes for dealing with the police) is to only answer QUESTIONS, and never answer STATEMENTS. If a person has a question, force them to ask it by refusing to respond to a STATEMENT with a STATEMENT of your own.
Also, if you get a vague question, translate it into clear language, repeat it back to them and ask them: “is this what you mean?”
Then and only then, should you answer the question. Its really interesting watching white men “find their way” through this attack on their being. It just proves that a codes effect functions independent of its practitioner.
Tally ho.
April 5th, 2013 at 11:12 am
True.
April 5th, 2013 at 11:24 am
I’ve yet to hear a single case of any Manosphere, Game, seduction or PUA blogger getting framed or fucked due to his photos being searched online.
———————————————————————–
Back off Kenny. It is rare for the victim to be OPENLY attacked for what got the attention of the perp. You get attacked for something else, even if its not true. Remember the “Million Man March?”. Lots of black males said: “I would attend, but I don’t want to get in trouble…” Rather than attack them for telling you the truth, it is better to remind them their “excuse” is proof they are already in trouble; thank them for their honesty, and move to the next victim.
April 5th, 2013 at 12:28 pm
Roosh “WF Price probably fits this profile best.”
Seems like Price is on the verge of folding. He’s being bled white.
April 5th, 2013 at 12:51 pm
@SSM, Susan’s express mission of her blog is to build a better beta:
https://rationalmale.wordpress.com/2011/12/05/build-a-better-beta/
For her, Game is only a tool to better effect the feminine imperative, so whenever she concedes anything about Game it’s in the context of how it will exclusively better women’s lives. Any derivation from that context is labeled selfish, misogynistic and ‘Dark Triad’ no matter how self-destructive the ends to which her beta army will go to in order to placate to the feminine imperative.
Aunt Giggles is a fish in water being told she’s wet. Anything that exclusively benefits women implicitly MUST also benefit men because the feminine imperative is the only context she’ll allow herself to be conscious of.
April 5th, 2013 at 1:01 pm
@Kate
That would be a nice topic to explore, the willfull ignorance of the SMP that has persisted for thousands of years. What we call “red-pill wisdom” is not a difficult concept by any stretch of the imagination. You don’t need fancy sociology degrees to get it. All you need is a little bit of experience and open eyes and the painful truth fits perfectly. What makes it more believable is that there is no inherent inequality in it, only painful realities for either sex and the best explanation for the human behavior that results from those realities. It makes me believe that all past social sex studies failed because the researchers themselves were incapable of removing themselves from the equation, they were incapable of recognizing their own bias so they could remove it.
I’ve got many face-time colleagues and friends who are very very internet saavy. Even a few of the type who don’t sleep because… just one more page to read… Only ONE of those friends has heard of the manosphere and read up on it. He is married to his HS sweetheart for probably 20 years now, no kids, no plans on kids, they’re DINKs and their marriage will probably never fail because she’s as much of a nerdy engineer as he is. The rest of the people I know simply have never heard of these blogs/vlogs or the knowledge contained therein. It is a foreign concept to them. My parents still think the SMP is the same as it was for them. My siblings are either riding the carousel (only sister), or jobless and sexless and clueless (oldest and youngest brother), or married a second time w/kids and a retail job (final brother). I am the only person I know who has both found these pages and read them *and* is in a position to possibly put them into practice in the SMP.
Everyone else just says, “Men/Women… they don’t make sense, who can know them?”
But we know that’s nonsense. We know that Men and Women are both given different sets of conditions, and they respond reasonably predictably based on their starting points. And the only difference between all the people I know and me is I found the manosphere with a receptive mind. This doesn’t make me special, but it does raise the valid question of why such a simple concept is being willfully ignored by people fully capable of recognizing it. Is it just too painful? Is it too personal? Are women unwilling to recognize the fleeting nature of their wonderful gift of SM power? Are they deliberately blind to the precious little time this gives them to find the man they want? Are they intentionally ignoring how horrible their future can be without a committed man by their side as they age? Are men lying to themselves about women because of an instinct to protect them? Are men willfully failing to recognize the tremendous value in their own utility and commitment and the need to save it for those who deserve it? Is everyone just perfectly lied to such that what they want to believe is what they’re given?
April 5th, 2013 at 1:22 pm
Susan isn’t so much against game; she’s against game when it’s used to further men’s SMP goals rather than women’s SMP goals. Basically, she wants nice betas to learn just enough game to make themselves into appealing relationship prospects for carousel riding party girls, but not quite enough game to where they’d be able to join in that carousel party themselves.
April 5th, 2013 at 1:23 pm
Ah okay, I see Rollo said pretty much the same thing in different words.
April 5th, 2013 at 1:25 pm
Okay, I just skimmed through the neary three full pages of comments over at hookinguptart. Rule #1 of internet wars: don’t fight the enemy on their own territory. Be proactive, not reactive. I think that was Rollo’s original point here.
April 5th, 2013 at 1:34 pm
I have a feeling Giggles is going to delete my last post there, so you’ll have to excuse my c&p here:
OK Suz, I understand your inherent feminine need to manufacture your own indignation when you feel lacking in attention. I’m always an easy source of that for you because I’m the only one of the big four who’ll come over to your sandbox and play with you. You ever notice that while everyone in the manosphere spreads their comments around other blogs Suz almost never does? Again, kind of cowardly.
However, the question I want to ask is this: If 3MM isn’t your ideal spokesman for the manosphere, who would be? Which luminary of the manosphere would you see best representing us?
You see, your whole premise that the manosphere has a PR problem is horse shit. What would fix that PR problem Suz? A better upfront, spokesman using his real name?
Lets say that guy exists and he has a rock solid grasp of Game, the feminine imperative, gender-based legal issues, has all the stats to back it up, and is a proponent of all of the male-specific ideas developed in the community over the last 13 years. Lets say he’s well spoken, well educated, is good looking and personable too. His delivery is flawless, but his perspective is an amalgamation of everything ever considered in the manosphere by the 3R’s, VD, Dalrock and every significant blogger in the community for the last decade. Is it his presentation or what he’s presenting that offends you?
This is why you’re full of crap: it’s not the delivery, it’s whats being delivered that bothers you. You are so fundamentally incapable of disassociating your ego from a fem-centric reality that anything marginally contradictory to it is automatically labelled misogyny. You are literally no better than the feminists you claim to despise because you lack the capacity to see past anything that doesn’t solipsistically benefit a female context.
You are to the manosphere what Hugo Schwyzer is to feminism – a shill, a false-flag vichy blogger who hopes to sanitize Game and the manosphere to better serve the feminine imperative. And just like Hugo, no one on the side you claim to represent will ever afford you the legitimacy you mistakenly believe you have.
April 5th, 2013 at 1:34 pm
That Mark Minter sex offender guy lives in Florida. I live in Texas. There is also a Mark Minter that is big deal at Nintendo. Notice she didn’t pull him out to confuse him me. Also that Mark Minter sex offender guy has a mug shut. My Facebook photo is readily viewable.
But fuck ’em. Here I am. Come get me motherfuckers.
April 5th, 2013 at 1:46 pm
Yep, I was right.
April 5th, 2013 at 1:53 pm
@Jeremy: That’s a lot of questions! :)
“Is it just too painful? Is it too personal?”
Most people have trouble with introspection and criticism, even when its constructive.
“Are women unwilling to recognize the fleeting nature of their wonderful gift of SM power? Are they deliberately blind to the precious little time this gives them to find the man they want? Are they intentionally ignoring how horrible their future can be without a committed man by their side as they age? Are men lying to themselves about women because of an instinct to protect them? Are men willfully failing to recognize the tremendous value in their own utility and commitment and the need to save it for those who deserve it? Is everyone just perfectly lied to such that what they want to believe is what they’re given?”
They are simply ignorant. One can’t know what they don’t know. Most people can only learn through experience. And what one hasn’t experienced, one can’t understand. At best we can start to think, well, since I haven’t had that experience, I can’t really know. We can start to recognize our own ignorance.
April 5th, 2013 at 2:06 pm
I have a joking thought sometimes that the Mark Minter sex offender guy in Florida ever says
“Look, stop confusing me with Manosphere guy. I am Mark Minter the sex offender, not Mark Minter the Manosphere guy, OK? I’m sick of taking his fucking heat. Back off. I hate him for what he did to my name.”
April 5th, 2013 at 2:59 pm
@ b-166-er: Great stuff. I’m no fan of the NOI, but quality of delivery =/= quality of message.
Our advantage, should we choose to recognize it, is that the very Game fundamentals we teach to each other are what we can use to spread that message itself.
In our case, Truth=our message=the most effective way to convey that message
April 5th, 2013 at 3:36 pm
@Kate
That may be a fundamental aspect of human nature holding people back in this. I’ve always found introspection exceptionally easy and part of my daily thought process, so I can’t say I have any familiarity with a lifestyle of not self-examining.
Oh, I like the humans-are-ignorant argument more than anyone. My favorite quote is one from Einstein in this regard, you’ve probably heard it. However, I think in this case this argument actually requires a defense (yes, a shocking concept). The fundamental truths in red-pill land are too simple and profound to plead ignorance because too many educated people have studied this stuff. It would require a willfull ignorance of the data at hand by sociologists and those who thought along these lines from the beginning of the renaissance forward to explain where we are now in blue-pill land.
April 5th, 2013 at 5:00 pm
If anybody’s in the mood to spread the word, a mainstream conservative female blogger is just barely dipping her toe into red pill territory.
http://neoneocon.com/2013/04/05/marriage-when/
April 5th, 2013 at 5:06 pm
@GLC: That is despicable and I pray for your health.
Thank you. The Mating Game isn’t the only area where a person can get screwed by not opening their eyes. It isn’t even the worst. Not even close. And it isn’t gender specific- there are more women dealing with this than there are men.
I have lost a few years of my life to this and it still isn’t over. Just because I took a pill that was prescribed by my doctor without doing my own research. No one ever told me I had to do that. Just like no one ever told me that I have to question what I was taught about women.
April 5th, 2013 at 5:48 pm
Another commenter over there keeps chiding her to respond to my comment. She has absolutely no way to respond, so of course she manages to redirect topic, essentially accusing me of being a misogynist in the process.
How convenient. Redirect, then break out the shaming language.
April 5th, 2013 at 8:16 pm
Brave move the parm of 3MM. I think he knew this wasn’t gonna be a debate before the interview even started. A ‘discussion’ isn’t a free-flow of ideas. It’s an ‘education’ from one side to the other. It’s patronizing like what you would get with a Black nationalist about slavery if you have the guts to say there were Africans who played a big role in the whole thing.
It’s a meaningless conversation because what happened happened so that’s that.
April 5th, 2013 at 9:23 pm
Been a busy couple just caught up w/the comments and looks like we moved on (good thing) but my $0.02: I don’t know why anyone reads HUS.
April 5th, 2013 at 10:55 pm
Someone wrote: “She does not understand that much of the “debate” will be bad-faith accusations of misogyny to guilt you into shutting up, and also to harm your livelihood.”
Sue wrote: “Do we know of a single case of this? Someone getting fired for anti-feminist views? I have never heard of it. In fact, I have never heard of anyone being fired for personal views of any kind. Can you provide examples please? I remain convinced this is paranoia.”
…………..well I think it’s pretty clear why no one can get the point of annonymity through to her. So much lol. One reason I’m glad her blog exists is that it’s a great glimpse into watching a hamster in action. Like the cognitive dissonance and rationalizing and backtracking and complete lack of self-awareness when it suits her agenda, it’s fascinating to watch in real-time.
April 5th, 2013 at 11:21 pm
Is this the only comment section in the manosphere that isn’t a complete circle jerk of libertarian blaming fantasies?
April 6th, 2013 at 12:59 am
Just left this comment. I’ll be surprised if it lasts past tomorrow morning:
For someone who claims to be concerned about the message being able to stand on its own you have to rely on an awful lot of weak feminist style debate tactics to avoid backing up your own positions.
In the comments of this post alone you have resorted to attacking people’s looks, attacking relatives, accusations of misogyny (a catch-all term for anything that is critical of women, right or wrong), comment moderation/deletion, accusations of cowardice, oh yea…..and redirecting the argument when a logical response would have discredited your entire post.
A couple of posters have chided you to respond to my earlier comment. You’ve had a day and a half to come up with a reasonable response. Care to take another stab at it?
April 6th, 2013 at 1:26 am
I’ve addressed Susan a few times for some of the claims that she’s made. I’ve been fairly neutral to her and have tried not to sound hostile towards her. She did manage to throw in a jab at me saying that I’m not good looking like “Tom Brady” to even make glances at her like 3MM had suggested on that quote used in the HuffPo interview. But she hasn’t even managed to address the arguments that I’ve made. I’m just gonna go out on a small limb here and say that she’s really not much of an intelligent person. I really don’t mean that just to insult her. I really mean that sincerely. She seems to write well and seems to be capable of carrying a good conversation but she’s not really making much sense in her reasoning. Either that, or she’s being intellectually dishonest, or willfully ignorant or something, but whatever it is, it’s not good.
April 6th, 2013 at 2:27 am
Giggles is a valuable asset to the manosphere because she is a real world example of the feminine imperative and feminist-in-moderate/male-friendly-clothing. Her posts and real-time (i.e., until she edits and deletes) comment/moderation behavior also provide a good litmus test as to whether someone is truly red pill or ready to start taking the red pill.
April 6th, 2013 at 6:53 am
I sometimes get recognised when walking around London. Some guy will come up and say he reads my blog, a guy I’ve never seen before who is trying his hand at daygame. It’s all quite innocent so I give them the time of day. I remember how it was to be in their shoes.
But it happens about 1 in 5 times I go out around the daygame spots. What would happen if I was as high profile as Roosh and also had haters? How much more attention would I attract and what type of attention?
Haters have zero morals. They’ll do anything they can to fuck you up. Do I really want some crazy femcunts following me down the street shouting obscenities? Do I want to be knocking out creepy white knights every Sunday afternoon? There’s a cost to having some of your identity public when you are telling “truth to power”.
In a more extreme example, who are the very first people to be rounded up by the secret police?
April 6th, 2013 at 9:26 am
Ace : “It’s a meaningless conversation because what happened happened so that’s that.”
Being a Brit, I get that a lot when the slavery thing pops up. “Education”. Just deflect it by saying “no, it must have bin them other guys, they’re even whiter”, and pointing at the nearest Polack or Swede.
TBF my “people’s” experience of slavery is limited to centuries of mass abductions by Muslim pirates, up until the State got its Navy up to scratch and was able to go after them. And the deportation of conquered (mainly Celtic) tribes as slave labor to the New World.
Thus giving rise to expansionist seaborne colonialism.
“Right, we’ve fucked the Corsairs up good and proper, what do we do now? We’ve got all these incredibly expensive ships and cannons, no jobs, and if we don’t stop the Dagoes and the Frogs, they’ll become so rich they’ll try to invade again, and set the Inquisition on us all. Gulp!”
April 6th, 2013 at 9:52 am
krauser: “There’s a cost to having some of your identity public when you are telling “truth to power”.
In a more extreme example, who are the very first people to be rounded up by the secret police?”
If your public profile develops, I wouldn’t be surprised if a will arises among the GuardianReader/SJWs to harass the Met into putting a tail on you, for being a “stalker” or “serial harasser” of “vulnerable (foreign) wimminz” or some such bollocks.
At the very least they might pilot the facial recognition on the CCTV networks before the next riots using you as a conveniently-located, always available “beta”-tester lol. The hat’s a dead giveaway for starters, why do you think all the lads wear hoodies? Everybody knows they look like shit.
You could end up being monstered by the red-tops into the same cage as the Pakistani paedophile rings. It’s all the same, in the radfems’ watery eyes.
April 6th, 2013 at 1:23 pm
With respect to anonymous Manosphere bloggers, there are a number of simple factors in effect.
If you bother to read that HUS post and the comments, you’ll see that Game and its mainstream image isn’t the issue really discussed there. Walsh is merely using that TV segment as an excuse to declare that nobody should able to spread „misogyny” online anonymously. Nothing more, nothing less. She doesn’t say, of course, that misogynists should be silenced and censored. What she does say is that they should be able to say what they want, but only if they suffer all and any social/economic repercussions that result.
This, of course, is nothing new. Some of you may probably recall that Denise Romano, a prominent feminist charlatan, has also made it a talking point of hers that she’s writing under her real name whereas her „cowardly” opponents are anonymous. But it’s not even her that this whole idea originates from. It originates from feminists in general, who are just one interest group that advocates the legal curtailment and even banning of online anonymity. That’s the real issue. There have been many news stories about such laws passed in South Korea, for example, and pushed in some federal states of the USA. It’s happening slowly but surely.
The days of online anonymity are numbered, because its enemies are numerous and influential: feminists, the record industry, other lobby groups against online piracy and so on. And you can now see that Walsh is pretty much siding with them because…well, in case you didn’t notice it already, she craves mainstram acceptance – not merely mainstream exposure, mind you, but *acceptance* – and all the goodies it brings: fame, book deals, invitations to popular TV and radio shows, you name it. She fancies herself as some relationship advice guru and she knows she won’t become one unless she’s co-opted by those who control mainstream discourse, unless she does everything to lure in as many female readers as possible.
And the easiest way to do that is to start feuds with the Manosphere again and again. It also enables her to get rid of her competitors. You remember that Lady Raine outed Roissy with the help of Denise Romano, do you? Walsh surely does. That’s why she’s now encouraging her female readers, most of whom are miserable, bitter losers just like Lady Raine, to track down and out Rollo, Dalrock and all other „misogynist” bloggers they can find.
April 6th, 2013 at 2:11 pm
@Immediate 11:21 pm wrote:
“Is this the only comment section in the manosphere that isn’t a complete circle jerk of libertarian blaming fantasies?”
Amen man, amen.
Breath o’ cool, fucking crisp and clean ocean fresh air here. One of many reasons I love this place.
April 6th, 2013 at 2:13 pm
I’m back! (In Google chrome/mobile hotspot heaven!) Is she actually advocating that, Hollenhund? I would advise people to stop posting there.
April 6th, 2013 at 2:31 pm
She does. Look at that thread and see for yourself. She comes up with all sorts of pop psychology explanations why anonymous Manosphere bloggers hide their identity for nefarious reasons. She specifically attacks some of them for being “cowards”. Plus she describes how any of her female readers can contract an IT expert to track down the IP address of a blogger and then find his real identity. She’s whipping her female readers into an orgy of hatred, which isn’t terribly difficult considering that most of them are frustrated, luckless, bitter single women on a straight path to spinsterhood.
April 6th, 2013 at 2:57 pm
I find it amusing how she tries so hard to draw a line between “dark” game and “regular”?? game, and how Rollo is characterized as the Dark Lord of Misogyny.
Build a better beta, indeed.
April 6th, 2013 at 3:04 pm
@BC 2:27 wrote:
“Giggles is a valuable asset to the manosphere because she is a real world example of the feminine imperative and feminist-in-moderate/male-friendly-clothing. Her posts and real-time (i.e., until she edits and deletes) comment/moderation behavior also provide a good litmus test as to whether someone is truly red pill or ready to start taking the red pill.”
Actually despite my earlier rhetorical jab, I agree with this, though I’m not sure I’d go as far as “valuable asset”. Preferred term would be “useful”.
Rollo likens the process of disconnecting a blue-piller from the matrix as “triage” and frequently indicates that it is dirty work. My own experience routinely plays this out for men and women alike. A regular deficiency of “red pill” folks is the blinding conviction that their world view is so obvious. Deep emotional roots stretching through acres of cherished ego identity keep blue pill renewing year on year even after the topsoil has long since washed away. It’s the only thing most people know.
Prying them away so they can take root in more fertile lands is dirty work indeed, and you do have to discriminate between people who came into the ER with a head ache who aren’t even sure they should be there and will probably leave / walk-out before the doctor can even see them, versus those with a leg half-severed who want to see a doctor now and will follow medical orders like they understand that their lives depend on it … and everything in between.
With women friends in particular, who start projecting signals of red-pill awareness together with confusion over what they’ve been fed their whole lives and why it isn’t working out for them, I first direct them to HUS. Sometimes they come back like a racquetball bounced off their shoulder … no take, no compute, no fertile ground. Other times they are more introspective, reflective, troubled, that indicates roots are taking hold and we can begin taking on cherished tropes, slowly.
April 6th, 2013 at 4:32 pm
I listened to part of that and I thought the Manosphere blogger didn’t stand a chance. For one, the moderator was ripping him for being anonymous. Why is that an issue? Two, he was seriously outmanned (or outwomaned), including the AFC host, who tries to sound macho with a few cuss words tossed in.
I applaud 3MM, however, for putting himself out there. I just think this will continue to be an underground/cult movement. The female imperative is strong. I talk to my male friends about some of the things on this blog and some look at me like I’m a whacko.
Good effort by 3MM.
April 6th, 2013 at 4:59 pm
Roosh explains the need for manosphere anonymity better than I can:
http://www.rooshv.com/the-most-insidious-method-of-control-never-devised
Sort of puts Aunt Giggles true motives into perspective doesn’t it?
April 6th, 2013 at 5:11 pm
And what can you do?
I would advise anyone connected with this blog not to go over there and visit her.
I doubt we are anywhere near being large drivers of her traffic, but any little bit counts.
At the very least, we should not be involved in our own destruction.
April 6th, 2013 at 9:07 pm
(Walsh)’s now encouraging her female readers, most of whom are miserable, bitter losers just like Lady Raine, to track down and out Rollo, Dalrock and all other „misogynist” bloggers they can find.
You caught that, too, eh? And all with plausible deniability (hypothetical examples, etc.), just like the passive-aggressive coward she is.
April 6th, 2013 at 9:25 pm
Catching up on the histrionics, one of my favorite quotations from Oscar Wilde’s The Importance of Being Earnest came to mind: “Never speak disrespectfully of Society, Algernon. Only people who can’t get into it do that.” Translation: outsiders love to gossip about insiders. Consider yourselves complimented and go about your business :)
As for SSM, who was repeatedly thrown under the bus, I found it particularly distasteful to have her story (which I admit I did not know as I only started reading her blog a little before it shut down) talked about so carelessly by someone who admitted to not having read it at all when I *know* – because we discussed it on her blog- that the reason she shared certain things about her past was to help others avoid mistakes. Such a noble purpose! It is not charitable or respectful to judge others without walking a mile in their shoes.
Without having made mistakes, none of us would have learned anything. And have nothing to teach others. I suppose there are some lucky people who make it through life entirely perfectly, but, if so, wouldn’t you think they’d be happier and humbler? No, I am afraid it is those who have stumbled and fallen and bloodied their knees who have the truest appreciation for happiness and don’t seek to bring others down, only raise others up.
April 7th, 2013 at 2:09 am
Cosplay Model Bottom-Fishes Omegas for Validation at Cons, gets pissed and Trolls the White Knight Community when one or two are socially-awkward:
http://www.geeksaresexy.net/2013/04/04/costumes-are-not-consent-combatting-cosplayer-harassment/
http://meagan-marie.tumblr.com/post/46396481491/what-would-you-do-if-you-werent-afraid
April 7th, 2013 at 8:41 am
Game has been in the mainstream for a long time. A series of movies make reference direct and indirect to Red Pill wisdom.
The problem is always that the guy who plays the “Game” character is usually portrayed as dim-witted ass-hole whom girls flock to or a rich dude whom girls flock to for his money.
Look at any self-confident movie or tv character and there is never any mention of game.
Only when there is a game reference is the character usually a caricature: easy example? Joey from Friends…he’s the sub-plot even though he did get his own spinoff.
The Ross/Rachel, Chandler/Monica dynamic is the one most explored where the girls always win.
Joey wins, but he’s kind of “out of the mainstream”.
Draper is an example, but the time difference—the 60’s—makes that a bit of a touger analogy.
April 7th, 2013 at 1:31 pm
If you want to persuade MEN, not boys, you have to offer them something of value. Men, fully grown brothers of ours, respond to duty, honour, justice. Roissy, Roosh, Tyler? What do they offer? Rules of how to bang women? Their only agenda is SEX — and they will sacrifice everything for that, even their soul. They´ve turned into women themselves, this is precisely how women operate.
You will NOT persuade fully grown MAN with this message. What do you offer?
1. let´s fuck married women (aka destroy your brother – her husband),
2. so much hatred, aggresivity, weakness/turning into dark side (roissy),
3. lllegitimate bastards and clownish attitude (Tyler).
MEN are strong and POSITIVE, they fought and DIED for values like justice, freedom, etc. If manosphere wants to go mainstream, it has to be represented by the MAN, not by such little, insignificant FEMININE loosers. Sorry for the message, but there is no use of pretending anything. You might have succeed to persuade some beaten up looser or men used and harmed by women – WEAK men, but you will not catch succesfull, strong MAN with drive – the kind that actually COULD change anything.
April 7th, 2013 at 1:57 pm
@YaReally
The old location wasn’t good long term hosting. You can link here: http://lumpypua.github.io/YaReallyArchive/
Def credit me for the compilation! Yup, automatically generated. Here’s the (not pretty) code to do it: https://github.com/LumpyPUA/YaReallyArchive
April 7th, 2013 at 3:17 pm
And a fair lesson to give the guys who are learning to game for ‘GOOD CAUSE”.
If you want to learn the game in order to be better at the male/female interaction, have more confidence, self-esteem, great!!
If you are learning the game in order to play multiple women, become a better PUA, juggler, you will find yourself with the women who either think they are not worth anything more than that, or not smart enough to figure that game out.
Learning enough game for self-confidence is good, learning so much game that you play every “thang” you can find, you will surely get what you ask for. You will not find any real women, because they will see through that game.
April 7th, 2013 at 3:23 pm
[…] Rollo Tomassi dissects the Manosphere’s crossover with the mainstream media. Rollo has since provided a lot of private support and backing via email email which I really appreciate. […]
April 7th, 2013 at 5:16 pm
The London Real guys have said that Krauser’s interview provoked the strongest social media reaction of ALL their interviews, by a very long shot.
As for how long it takes to turn the meta social dynamics of the [western?] world around. I’m patient and take pop shots when I can. One of our biggest weapon is our spending power. Currently the spending power of Red Pill people is a minuscule fraction of the FI Leutenents and foot soldiers but just like the effects of compound interest, if we all make intelligent and informed purchasing decisions, we, or our enlightened offspring, will get there in the end.
April 8th, 2013 at 2:56 am
Google trends says a bit about how popular searches for MMSL is… Spiking quite nicely.
http://www.google.com/trends/explore#q=mmsl&date=1%2F2010%2041m&cmpt=q
April 8th, 2013 at 3:38 am
wtf?! i’m so sick of these acronyms. what the hell is mmsl?
April 8th, 2013 at 6:21 am
http://marriedmansexlife.com/
April 8th, 2013 at 6:33 am
ah thanks rollo. sorry for the negative tone. its just annoying that i have to skim through all the posts and almost all of them have acronyms that spiral me into another google search of what they all mean, and sometimes i still can’t even find them.
April 8th, 2013 at 6:36 am
This link will help with acronyms:
http://www.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/17xmry/acronym_and_glossary_thread/
April 9th, 2013 at 10:48 am
@Lumpy
Awesome! You just made a bunch of Manosphere dudes trying to learn game happy. People keep complaining that my writing is scattered all over the sphere and hard to find/reference lol
Is there a way I can run it once a week to keep updating it regularly with my new stuff, or would I have to figure out a bunch of crazy Python stuff? I’ll definitely credit you, this is awesome! :D
Sorry for the off-topic Rollo, have you got an E-Mail addy Lumpy?
April 9th, 2013 at 6:44 pm
“Sue wrote: “Do we know of a single case of this? Someone getting fired for anti-feminist views? I have never heard of it. In fact, I have never heard of anyone being fired for personal views of any kind. Can you provide examples please? I remain convinced this is paranoia.””
Gosh, I dunno, ask Larry Summers, former president of Harvard.
April 9th, 2013 at 6:49 pm
Arguing things out in the MSM will be a tough slog. Basically, you won’t win unless and until they let you. On the bright side, they want to talk to you and you don’t really need to talk to them.
April 10th, 2013 at 1:00 am
[…] 3MM on Huffpo. Related: Rollo on the interview. […]
April 10th, 2013 at 3:47 pm
[…] to me how close to the line I’m treading. That this game I play has risks, and there are all too many people willing to throw me under the bus if desired. For a large part I’m protected and simply don’t give a damn, but that […]
April 11th, 2013 at 6:49 pm
well, , the only red pill celebrity I know of is . . TED the living teddy bear!!
Who gets hired after badmouthing an interview and gets promoted after humping a coworker at working hours?
Gotta have some of those hookahs
April 30th, 2013 at 11:58 am
doing an interview *for* the lamestream media is beta. there’s just no reason to participate in any MSNBC/ABC/FOX/CBS/MTV/HUFF article/interview/TVshow at all. they’re the matrix.
the people you want to talk to aren’t watching Huff TV, they’re on the internet. just deal with it.
May 16th, 2013 at 10:03 am
Having just been enlightened to this world but in finding out more I find it incredibly frustrating to have to delve into all this jargon. I read this article to know how to become unplugged from the ‘beta’ world. There are some excellent point here but is it really necessary to involve all these initiallism and jargon? Does it make those ‘insiders’ who are in the know more secure? That is usually the reason jargon it is used. The excuse is to put ideas into precise terms, this goes for most professions but actually its about ego boosting at the expense of clarity for exclusivity to make it as hard as possible for those with little knowledge to access this stuff. To that end you seem to be succeeding well.
May 16th, 2013 at 11:51 am
@Luke, start by reading these posts:
http://therationalmale.com/the-best-of-rational-male-year-one/
I understand your hesitancy. A lot of the manosphere seems cultish or self-aggrandizing when you first look at it, but try to understand that much of what seems like ‘inside’ information amongst those ‘in the know’ stems from a need for terms.
Acronyms and jargon come from a need to describe a concept as a point of reference. For instance we may use AFC for average frustrated chump. That probably seems derogatory (and sometimes it is) but it’s a term used for reference – the AFC is the Beta (another term) nice-guy frustrated with his lack of understanding Game and the inter-social dynamics that keep him stuck in his lot.
We have a term for that guy because it’s a convenience. For the most part, a majority of the manosphere used to be that guy and they recognize the personality, the thinking, etc. of a guy still plugged-in to his feminized social conditioning.
We may call this blue-pill thinking in reference to the time before a man becomes self-aware of how he’s been conditioned (i.e. taking the red pill). We make reference to the movie The Matrix because it’s so apt in describing men’s conditioning.
Unfortunately for a guy newly introduced to red pill thinking and Game awareness, there’s a lot of referencing to catch up on, but understand they’re conveniences that have evolved for over 12 years now. Try reading the links on the Year One post I linked you, it’ll help familiarize you with the concepts.
You may also have a look at this link of acronyms:
http://www.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/17xmry/acronym_and_glossary_thread/
May 16th, 2013 at 1:11 pm
Thank you for your reply I will read them all, I have to. This is very overwheming and often upsetting stuff. The alternative ignoranceis very much more upsetting. I may be 50 but I will not spend another day as a volutary slave.
August 15th, 2013 at 1:11 am
[…] him exclusive access to its most powerful media voice (Jezebel, BlogHer, Xojane, The Atlantic). It’s their game, and Hugo was the only man the feminine imperative was comfortable in legitimizing; he was one of […]
October 17th, 2013 at 2:55 pm
any time you used “women” or similar in the article, it should be replaced with ” jews”
– examples….
“̶w̶o̶m̶e̶n̶ Jews are the sole arbiters of relationship wisdoms” …and….
“the f̶e̶m̶i̶n̶i̶n̶e̶ jew imperative will readily use men’s default lack of legitimacy for its own purpose”